#667 &#8211; Clutter Free Finances: Taking Control of Subscriptions

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Meet Our Co-Host

Tonya Kubo

Tonya Kubo is the illustrious and fearless leader of Kathi Lipp’s Clutter Free Academy Facebook group and the Clutter Free for Life membership program. A professional community strategist, she believes everyone deserves to have a place online where they feel like they belong. Raised by a hoarder, Tonya knows firsthand the pain and isolation that comes from living in conditions others don’t understand. She wants better for her family and her cluttery peeps, which is why she is passionate about the compassionate slow-and-steady approach that makes Clutter Free unique. She lives in the heart of California with her husband, Brian, their two spirited daughters, and one very tolerant cat. Visit tonyakubo.com to find out more about her community work, or email her at tonya@kathilipp.org to discuss the Clutter Free Academy podcast and programs.

Transcript

Kathi Lipp (00:09)

Well, hey friends, welcome to Clutter Free Academy where our goal is to help you take small doable steps to live every day with less clutter and more life. And we are talking money today. We are talking money, money, money. And I am here talking money with my friend Tonya Kubo, who, you know, we just have so much of it. We don’t know what to do with it. That’s the problem, right Tonya? Yes.

Tonya Kubo (00:33)

Right, right. That money

tree in the backyard is like worse than a lemon tree.

Kathi Lipp (00:37)

It’s been so…

Now, okay, did watch, speaking of trees, I watched a video last night of somebody talking about, he’s in construction and somebody, they were working on their house and they said, ? you should probably tell your workers not to eat the apples off of that tree. And he said, my goodness, I’m so sorry.

Normally when we go and work on people’s houses, they have no problem with it. And she said, no, it’s no problem. It’s just that those have not been processed. And he said, well, what do you mean? She says, well, those are like backyard apples, but they’re not store apples. he’s like, so tell me what’s wrong with them? And well, they haven’t been processed like as if they were going through a store and we just don’t want any of your workers to get sick.

And so she honestly thought that the apples at the store were a different kind of apple, like a different variety than the one. And he’s like, well, why would you have an apple tree? And she says, it just looks pretty. And first of all, I’ve had apple trees before. Those are the messiest trees in the world if you’re not constantly eating them. OK, so that was a tangent that we didn’t need to go on. But you know,

Tonya Kubo (01:42)

Hmm.

They are super.

Kathi Lipp (02:04)

Because apple tree, well, don’t we all wish that we had an apple tree in our backyard now because we know some prices are gonna be going up here pretty soon if they haven’t already gone up for you. And we had a challenge in our Clutter Free for Life, which is our paid group. this was an impromptu challenge, but it was based on something I’ve been working on, I would say for the past five months. And.

Tonya Kubo (02:10)

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (02:31)

I just realized it’s very easy for me. We have become the this is the decade of the subscription. I know there were subscriptions before. I know there will be subscriptions in the 2030s, but this is where people said you can’t start a business unless it’s subscription based. Maybe it’s been longer than this, but this is where like I can. I have noticed that subscriptions keep.

Tonya Kubo (02:41)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (03:02)

I anything I want to buy they want it. I was trying to buy socks the other day. They wanted me to buy a subscription to socks. I’m like, yeah, I’m not doing that. Like I’m not changing out my feet. I don’t wear that many socks. It’s nutso we want to be subscribed to our food. We want to be subscribed to delivery. We to be subscribed to our television. And that was not all the unnecessary expenses in my budget, but it was a lot of them.

Tonya Kubo (03:09)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (03:32)

And I don’t know about other people who are listening, but I do feel like I have some insight after doing this experiment in Clutter Free for Life. Because I challenge people, just for the moment, could you save $1,000 a year just by going through your budget and canceling subscriptions, canceling things that are coming up that you are no longer using? And while I feel like I crushed this,

You crushed it like a tin can. And I was able to eliminate about $2,500 worth of reoccurring expenses for the year of our Lord 2025. And some of it was through canceling things, some of it was renegotiate. There were so many different varieties. But Tonya, how much did you end up cutting?

Tonya Kubo (04:14)

Mm-hmm.

So by the 28th of February, we actually landed at just shy of 5,000. I think it’s like 4,994 or something or other. Like ridiculousness.

Kathi Lipp (04:37)

It’s crazy.

Oh my gosh, did you so, when I find

$6 more and just, yeah.

Tonya Kubo (04:46)

Well, was Brian and I was like, what if I cancel this? He’s like, Tonya doesn’t count if you cancel it this month and then live to regret it and restart it next month.

Kathi Lipp (04:54)

Right, right. Well, okay.

You know what? This may be my first time that I ever disagree with Brian Kubo because we all know that I’m a Brian Kubo fan. But if you cancel something to see if you can live without it and you realize, yeah, no, this is really important to me. I think that’s a victory, but I understand his premise. So I don’t disagree with him, but I do think that there

Tonya Kubo (05:10)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Kathi Lipp (05:23)

there is value in saying, I’m gonna pull back, nope, I’ve decided this is worth the $12 a month. So I wanna get into this because I think it’s really, I think it’s a great challenge to see, could you eliminate $1,000 of reoccurring expenses in your year? And you think, well, $1,000 over an entire year doesn’t feel like very much, but.

Tonya Kubo (05:26)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (05:51)

Could you use an extra $80 a month? I know I can. And maybe if you haven’t been paying attention to your budget, maybe you could eliminate $2,000. It’s not that you’re not paying attention, but at one point in your life, at least for me, at one point in my life, Brit Box was very important to me. And then it became not so important to me. At one point in my life, I was helping, I bought a subscription for my kids.

Tonya Kubo (06:03)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (06:20)

that

was very important to them. Well, they don’t use it anymore. So why am I paying for it? So these are some things. why, I really believe that clutter and finances go together. Okay, so tell me what you think about that because it’s important to me.

Tonya Kubo (06:24)

Right. Right.

they totally do. Totally do.

Well, feel

like clutter and finances go together for a few things, right? So we know that we cluttery people really struggle with overwhelm, we struggle with decision fatigue. you you sign up, subscriptions are the bane of our existence, because you sign up and then they’re just like out of sight, out of mind. And then you, you know, in some cases, and this was something that Brian had figured out a few months ago,

Kathi Lipp (06:53)

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Tonya Kubo (07:10)

you’re subscribed to the same thing in three different ways. So that sort of stuff though, like the cluttery person’s overwhelming decision fatigue, I think leads to a lot of overspending, duplicate spending, also just unintentional spending. Like if you knew that was coming out of your account every single month, you would have canceled it long time ago, right? So there’s that piece, but then there’s the other piece where it just, I think it just weighs on our mind. I mean,

Kathi Lipp (07:27)

Great.

Right.

Tonya Kubo (07:39)

Ten charges coming out of your account every month are ten different things to keep track of.

Kathi Lipp (07:46)

It’s so true. this is why it’s so much like clutter, because it’s very easy to mindlessly have things come into the house and then they accumulate. You have to take care of them. instead of being intentional about what comes in, it’s very easy. Subscriptions are just habits that are unexamined habits sometimes.

Tonya Kubo (07:52)

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Kathi Lipp (08:14)

I know, you know, when I was in my first marriage, when I first got married and we were paying bills, you you’d sit down with your checkbook and you had your stack of envelopes and you had your stamps. And I think it was 13 cents at one point. I mean, like, you know, we’re talking back in the olden days and you knew every dollar that was going out of your account. That’s just not the case anymore.

Tonya Kubo (08:23)

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Kathi Lipp (08:40)

And

so it’s very easy to let those things build up without doing it. So Tonya, I told people was go through your bank account and see, you what are those reoccurring charges? What are those things that are coming out that maybe you’re not paying attention to? But you took it to a whole new level because you realize they’re getting money from us in ways that we may not even be aware of.

Tonya Kubo (08:50)

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

yeah. Okay. So I feel like here’s what’s really important is to understand that I have my own business. So part of why I could save almost $5,000 a year is because I did this in my business account in addition to in my personal account. But what we’re, it’s all real money. It affects how much I get to pay myself. Right? So that, that counts too. But to your point, you know, on my business side, there’s only like

Kathi Lipp (09:17)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Witcher is all real money, by the way. It’s all real mo- Yeah.

Exactly. Yes.

Tonya Kubo (09:40)

one way things come in or two ways, right? I either use my business debit card or I use PayPal. That’s it. That’s how I get charged on things. But I was not prepared for this, Kathi, but you’re right. I figured it out really fast. On the personal side, there are the bank account charges, right? The things that use your debit card. But then if you have credit cards, there’s the things that you put on a credit card and forgot you put on the credit card.

Kathi Lipp (09:47)

Right.

Mm-hmm.

Tonya Kubo (10:08)

And

if you don’t max out your credit cards, how would you really pay any attention? It’s like if your credit cards are always at zero, you’ll notice. And if your credit cards are always maxed out, you’ll notice. But if it’s anywhere in between, you wouldn’t. But then what we also discovered was PayPal subscriptions. So I had subscriptions hiding out in PayPal that I had no other record of that had to be canceled in PayPal, couldn’t be canceled anyplace else.

Kathi Lipp (10:16)

Mm-hmm.

Right. Hmm. Okay, yeah.

Mmm.

Yeah. Right.

Tonya Kubo (10:36)

which then led us on the trail of Google Pay or Apple Pay. Sometimes you have subscriptions directly through those. anybody who has done any of those, like if you do a lot of online shopping, right, you’ll notice that some, there’s shop accounts and they collect, they’re the ones who are facilitating your subscription service. There’s links.

Kathi Lipp (10:45)

Mm.

Guess.

my goodness.

Tonya Kubo (11:04)

So Kathi, I found subscriptions hiding in like six different locations just on my personal site.

Kathi Lipp (11:12)

It’s insane, right?

Tonya Kubo (11:13)

Right. And part of how I noticed was a couple hit that I wasn’t expecting. So the PayPal thing was I had an Evernote subscription. I started using Evernote in 2016 when my mom died. I’m like, no, no, it would have been 2015. So when my mom died, I needed a way for us to have all the information associated with her death and I needed to be able to access it at my computer.

Kathi Lipp (11:21)

Mm-hmm.

Mm, right.

Okay.

Tonya Kubo (11:41)

or on my phone and I needed Brian to be able to access it. And Evernote at that time was the easiest way to do that. So did you just hear me say my mom died in 2015? Yeah, so I haven’t actually accessed Evernote for anything else since then. And yet I got this notification from PayPal that they had processed a charge. And I’m thinking like, I don’t have anything coming out of PayPal. And it’s $120. And I go and look.

Kathi Lipp (11:47)

Mm-hmm.

Right? Ten years ago?

Tonya Kubo (12:11)

And it’s like, I’m still paying for Evernote?

Kathi Lipp (12:16)

Wow.

Tonya Kubo (12:17)

Why would I think about it? I haven’t touched it in years. But so that’s a charge that got canceled.

Kathi Lipp (12:20)

Right. That’s insane.

Yeah. it’s heartbreaking. It’s heartbreaking. And you think about the money that has been wasted. But here’s we’re going to reframe it. The money that will no longer be coming out of your account. Yeah.

Tonya Kubo (12:28)

Mm-hmm.

Exactly. Exactly.

And you know what? I know that we have a lot more to talk about on the savings front, but we should probably take a break, pay some bills, and then we’ll come right back.

Kathi Lipp (12:43)

Yeah. Okay. Yep.

Tonya Kubo (12:51)

And we’re back and we are talking about how we are saving. So Kathi, I just shared how I cut expenses that I kind of didn’t even realize I was spending for maybe a decade or so. How about you?

Kathi Lipp (12:52)

Okay.

You know, so a lot of things I did I realized a lot of my things were hidden inside of Amazon So, you know like Brit box and thing Acorn TV, you know things that you’re like, I’m totally into this show Well, I’m into that show and then I never use it again. So that was a problem and I I had to

Tonya Kubo (13:14)

Mmm.

You

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (13:34)

I had to reframe some of my thinking from, know, when it’s clutter, it’s like, do I need this to with subscriptions? Do I use this? Not will I use this? Because and you know, they they really play with our mentality saying, well, if you cancel it now, if you resubscribe later, it’s going to be more expensive.

Tonya Kubo (13:43)

Mm-hmm.

was hoping you

would address this because I think that holds us, Cluttery people in bondage, Kathi.

Kathi Lipp (13:59)

It’s so true because but I I had to think about okay, but if I cancel it and I resubscribe a year later That will cover me forever. That will cover me forever so and I am not paying for anything that I’m not using and so one of the things that I did was what are the alternatives so One thing that ended up being so interesting

Tonya Kubo (14:18)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (14:28)

was I was looking over all my subscriptions. This is something that’s really interesting. The subscriptions you actually use, are there other benefits that come with that subscription? So one of them for us was we were paying for Paramount Plus, which is like CBS. Because we use it all the time. Well, come to find out, our Walmart subscription had free Paramount Plus.

Tonya Kubo (14:37)

Mm-hmm.

includes it.

Kathi Lipp (14:57)

It included the one with the commercials, which Roger, every time we watch commercials says, we should pay for the, and I’m like, no, stop that, stop. You can sit through a commercial. Go to the bathroom, go put some more ice in your drink. that’s right, and I’ll scream, it’s coming back on! But what are the alternatives?

Tonya Kubo (15:05)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Go do what we did in the 80s, Roger.

Kathi Lipp (15:23)

we have become very impatient and I blame social media and I know you love social media, but I’m gonna blame social media here for something because it used to be a movie would come out and yeah, you talk about it with your friends, but you could see it. You could wait six months until it was out on VHS or on disc or whatever like that. But social media makes you feel like you are missing the most important thing in the world if you’re not at Wicked on opening night.

You know, it comes to find out you will live. You probably will live. Now there are things that will be exciting for you and you’ll want to go see, but you know what? It’s okay if you don’t do that. What are some alternatives? Can I wait to read that fiction book until it’s available at my library? Because there I can get it for free. What free apps could I use? Do I really need another subscription?

Tonya Kubo (15:58)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (16:22)

Or should I go investigate what’s actually on YouTube? Because there’s a lot of stuff on YouTube. Tubi, T-U-B-I, is a free streaming service. And if you’re like, yeah, but it doesn’t have this thing that I want to watch. One of the things that we are doing is we canceled our Apple subscription. We canceled a few other subscriptions, and we’re using the free versions, or we’re not using anything. But I will go back and subscribe.

Tonya Kubo (16:27)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (16:50)

You maybe every six months for a month and I’ll watch on Apple the morning show and Severance and like, you know, all the things I’ve been waiting for is going to be an awesome month. But, you know, for right now I can watch things on Paramount Plus. We do have Max, which has a lot of great shows. So we’re using that. But when it comes time for me to go to Apple, I’ll cancel my Max subscription for three to nine months.

Tonya Kubo (16:57)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (17:20)

and

wait till the things that I wanna watch are on there and it’s okay. I probably will not die. So I wanna let people know that every July we do something great in our Clutter Free Academy group and we do a Low by July. And so can you give us a little glimpse into what we do in our free group in the Low by July?

Tonya Kubo (17:24)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, so Low By July is simply about paying attention to your spending. So it’s not a spending freeze. It’s not, my gosh, I can’t drive across town because I’m not allowed to fill up my gas tank. It’s simply trying to minimize the impulse purchases we make, right? So it’s really looking at, you know, do I need to go to Starbucks every day?

Kathi Lipp (18:05)

Mm-hmm.

Tonya Kubo (18:17)

Do I need to go to Starbucks once a week? Are there alternatives that maybe I want to explore? And if ultimately you say, get so much joy out of going to Starbucks once a week compared to making coffee at home, then hey, that’s okay. So it’s really just figuring out how can you be more intentional with your spending and really focus on what makes sense for you and your family. And we do it in the free group because we know that the biggest…

Kathi Lipp (18:30)

Mm-hmm.

Tonya Kubo (18:45)

contributor to clutter is what we bring in the house. So if we can minimize what comes in the house, then our in-home decluttering efforts have a greater impact.

Kathi Lipp (18:48)

Mm-hmm. Great.

Yeah, it’s so easy to just do the same things out of habit You know, this is gonna sound ridiculous But I have been buying too much asparagus. Let me just be honest. Let me let me confess here There has been too much asparagus buying in my life. I’ve been buying the Costco size asparagus it’s just me and Roger and while we enjoy asparagus we don’t enjoy it that much and

Tonya Kubo (19:16)

Mmm.

Kathi Lipp (19:24)

What I’ve also come to notice in my patterns is we tend to eat a ton of asparagus when we’re grilling. But we’re not grilling right now because it’s March. And so to just take a step back and look at some habits that maybe you have that has been causing you to spend money. And so Tonya today, I’m gonna throw away some asparagus and I’m gonna do it guilt free. But what I’m not gonna do is put it

Tonya Kubo (19:31)

Hmm.

Right.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (19:53)

back on my Costco shopping list, I’m gonna put it back on there with a little parentheses that says May, because Mother’s Day is when we can pretty much guarantee we’re not gonna get more snow. And so this is the same thing. I’m gonna ask you to look at your habits. so a couple of things I wanna encourage you to do. Go over to the Facebook group, which is Clutterfree Academy, Kathi Lipps Clutterfree Academy.

Tonya Kubo (19:55)

Right.

Mm-hmm.

Hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (20:24)

and join us. So when July comes, you’ll know when we do our low by July, you’ll be you’ll already be a part of the group. You’ll already know. But I also want you to do something else. I would love this is my challenge to the people who are listening. Do a quick audit. What subscriptions or services are you paying for but not using? And we had somebody in our paid group, Clutter Free for Life, who said, I’m not doing this.

Tonya Kubo (20:41)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (20:53)

I’m not doing it because I grew up without a lot of money and I don’t want to be told what I can and cannot do and I want to enjoy these little luxuries in my life. Can I tell you that’s the exact opposite? I don’t want you, I don’t want you canceling things that bring you joy. I think many of us could eliminate a thousand dollars just by getting rid of the things that we are literally not using.

Tonya Kubo (21:11)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (21:24)

Or the next level is maybe we’re using it sometimes, but it’s not worth the amount of money we’re paying for it in proportion to the joy that we’re getting from it. And that’s what I want you to think about. if you’re willing to take the challenge, what I would encourage you to do is get into, just keep a little Excel spreadsheet or even on a notepad and go through your bank statement.

Tonya Kubo (21:36)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (21:53)

and figure out what those charges are because they do a really good job of calling them different things so you don’t know what you’re actually being charged for. So one of things I would encourage you to do is just take that name and put it into Google if you can, you know, if it’s, you know, Starbusters. Okay, what’s Starbusters? Is that a Starbucks, you know, sign off? Is it Starlink? I don’t know.

Tonya Kubo (22:15)

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Kathi Lipp (22:22)

but find out what it is. Somebody else will have Googled that and they can tell you what you’re paying for. And get rid of the things that are not actively improving your life. I wonder if many of our people could be saving 200, 500, $1,000 a year. Guys, so do the quick audit, get rid of some of those big ticket items. Next time, what we’re gonna be talking about,

Tonya Kubo (22:29)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (22:51)

we’re gonna talk to Tonya about how she renegotiated some of her bills. And I did one too. Let me just tell you, my savings were less than yours, but they all count. then cutting down on some of those reoccurring charges that are not bringing joy to your life. This was a great episode. Thank you so much, Tonya.

Tonya Kubo (22:55)

? yes I did do that.

Hahaha

? thank you for having me. This was great.

Kathi Lipp (23:16)

Okay, well.

Tonya Kubo (23:19)

And I think we are about at time, Kathi, but I want to say that I really hope that everybody listening takes that next step to do a quick audit. You are going to be amazed. And please make it judgment free. Don’t be like me. Don’t be all sad and feel like you have to go to confession in order to talk about the Evernote subscription that you had for a decade and you didn’t know about. Just judgment free, shame free. Just do that audit and see what you find.

Kathi Lipp (23:32)

Yeah, yeah, right.

You

Tonya Kubo (23:46)

And we will see you next time when we talk about those big ticket savings. So you have been listening to ClutterFree Academy. Now go create the ClutterFree life you have always wanted to live.

#667 – Clutter Free Finances: Taking Control of Subscriptions

Apr 29, 2025 | Clutter Free, Clutter Free For Life, Clutter Free Home, Clutter Free Podcast, Finances, Mental Load, Overwhelmed, Podcast

On this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo dive deep into the world of subscription services and the hidden costs they can incur over time. As many of us fall into the habit of acquiring more subscriptions than we need, our finances begin to...

#666 – The Nightstand Reset: Creating a Launch Pad for Peace

Apr 22, 2025 | Clutter Free, Clutter Free For Life, Clutter Free Home, Clutter Free Podcast, Home, Organizing, Overwhelmed, Podcast

In this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo delve into the importance of a tidy nightstand for a better night's sleep and a more organized life. They discuss Kathi's recent purchase of new nightstands with built-in outlets, her nighttime routine...

#665 – Declutter Your Spice Cabinet: From Chaos to Cooking Bliss

Apr 15, 2025 | Clutter Free, Clutter Free For Life, Clutter Free Home, Clutter Free Podcast, Home, Podcast, tips and ideas

In this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo tackle one of the most deceptively frustrating spots in your kitchen: the spice cabinet. If you’ve ever bought a second (or sixth) bottle of basil because you couldn’t find the first one, or had cumin...

#665 – Declutter Your Spice Cabinet: From Chaos to Cooking Bliss

by Clutter Free Academy Team | Apr 15, 2025 | Clutter Free, Clutter Free For Life, Clutter Free Home, Clutter Free Podcast, Home, Podcast, tips and ideas | 0 comments

#665 – Declutter Your Spice Cabinet: From Chaos to Cooking Bliss

Listen Now

In this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo tackle one of the most deceptively frustrating spots in your kitchen: the spice cabinet. If you’ve ever bought a second (or sixth) bottle of basil because you couldn’t find the first one, or had cumin avalanche onto your counter, this one’s for you. The duo shares budget-friendly, sanity-saving solutions to bring order and accessibility to your most flavorful clutter zone.

In This Episode You’ll Learn:

Why your spices should spark joy—and scent

Kathi’s five-tiered spice strategy (yes, really!)

Creative storage options for tiny kitchens, RVs, and big Costco-sized bottles

How to group spices for ease: singles vs. blends

The $13 Amazon tool that might change your dinner routine forever

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Sabbath Soup: Weekly Menus and Rhythms to Make Space for a Day of Rest

Kathi Lipp gives readers an easy-to-follow process for meal planning and prep, so that they can enjoy a full day each week of real rest and refreshment.

Could you use a break from cooking (and everything else) once a week? Not only is rest vital for your mind and body, it’s good for your soul too. God designed us to enter into Sabbath rest one day per week, but as you know, meals still need to be made. Your family still needs to be fed.

Sabbath Soup includes convenient, seasonal meal plans that take the guesswork out of shopping and cooking. More than just a collection of delicious recipes—including main dishes, breads, breakfasts, desserts, salads, sides, and yes, soups—this is your guide to establishing a weekly rhythm and routine of meal planning and prep that allows you to have a true day off.

Do something good for your soul and experience the peace that comes with a full day dedicated to spending time with God, family, and friends. Savor your Sabbath as you proudly proclaim, “Soup’s on!”

Order your copy of Sabbath Soup: Weekly Menus and Rhythms to Make Space for a Day of Rest here.

Links Mentioned:

Tiered Shelf
Expandable shelf
YouCopia Spice Organizer
Kathi’s Facebook Page (cooking lives are on Wednesdays!)

Download the Free Guide:
Spice Cabinet Makeover PDF– A step-by-step plan to sort, toss, and organize.

FYI: Some product links are affiliate links. If you buy, I may earn a small commission at no extra cost to you. Thanks for your support!

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Meet Our Guest

Tonya Kubo

Tonya Kubo is the illustrious and fearless leader of Kathi Lipp’s Clutter Free Academy Facebook group and the Clutter Free for Life membership program. A professional community strategist, she believes everyone deserves to have a place online where they feel like they belong. Raised by a hoarder, Tonya knows firsthand the pain and isolation that comes from living in conditions others don’t understand. She wants better for her family and her cluttery peeps, which is why she is passionate about the compassionate slow-and-steady approach that makes Clutter Free unique. She lives in the heart of California with her husband, Brian, their two spirited daughters, and one very tolerant cat. Visit tonyakubo.com to find out more about her community work, or email her at tonya@kathilipp.org to discuss the Clutter Free Academy podcast and programs.

Transcript

Kathi Lipp (00:54)

Well, hey friends, welcome to Clutter Free Academy, where our goal is to help you take small, doable steps to live every day with less clutter and more life. And guys, just welcome to our spiciest episode ever.

Tonya Kubo (01:10)

the puns.

Kathi Lipp (01:12)

Well, okay, we should let you guys know you don’t have to hide your kids for this this isn’t spicy like book talk spicy this No, no, no and you guys We we are here to talk about your spice cabinet very exciting right Tonya

Tonya Kubo (01:19)

Yeah, there’s no chili pepper spiciness on this one.

Super exciting. I mean, if you like to cook, it’s definitely exciting.

Kathi Lipp (01:35)

Yes, and we are just going to take advantage of some of our experience with organizing our spices and how to get that from going from cluttered and chaos to cooking optimized. That’s exactly what we want.

Tonya Kubo (01:53)

Yeah. And so Kathi, I’m just curious. I first of all, I’m loving the series that we’re doing where we’re taking like these small sections of the house that plague all of us so much when it comes to clutter. They just get out of hand easily. And I know that I’m not alone because we have this episode. So I know that you have the same problem where the spice cabinet drawer, whatever you like to do with your spices, like goes cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs. So

Kathi Lipp (02:04)

Mm-hmm.

Tonya Kubo (02:23)

Talk to us about yours.

Kathi Lipp (02:25)

Well, okay, I can talk to you about before, before I found the solution that actually works for me, because I’m gonna save that till the end, as you know, Tonya, I’m very proud of my spice system. yes.

Tonya Kubo (02:34)

Okay.

I know you are. I know you are. And I

haven’t seen the latest one, I don’t think.

Kathi Lipp (02:44)

Okay,

so well, I think you’ve seen part of it, but yes well there are layers much like a spicy stew. There are layers to my spice cabinet. Well, okay. So for years I tried different things. I did your traditional spice rack where you know, it was hanging up in the kitchen, but I didn’t love that because I I’m never the only time I ever owned spices where their containers matched.

Tonya Kubo (02:47)

Okay.

Ha ha!

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (03:14)

was the

Tonya Kubo (03:14)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (03:14)

day after I got married. Like somebody gave us a spice container. So I’ve had the kind that spin on your cabinet. I have the kind on the wall. But I also, not every spice company is equal. And some of them have spices that I really like. And then there are others like, I’m not a fennel person. Like fennel, my mom apparently,

Tonya Kubo (03:16)

Got it.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (03:40)

was addicted to fennel and anise. So black, black licorice flavors when she was pregnant with me. I can’t stand either of those. So like, I don’t need any of those. But you know, they come in different sizes, different containers, like, and what is a spice? I mean, I know what a spice is. But also, we have other things like the baking soda, baking powder, vanilla paste, all that kind of stuff.

Tonya Kubo (03:45)

Mm-hmm.

Hahaha

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (04:07)

So mine was kind of a jumble some of it looks super organized, but I wouldn’t say it was super functional and I would just waste time You know because some of the spices were behind other spices And then I’d run low on the spice and I’d re buy that spice only to find out. I actually had that spice somewhere

Tonya Kubo (04:10)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (04:31)

Spices should not be this big of an issue in a human’s life. It just shouldn’t be. How’s your spice situation?

Tonya Kubo (04:40)

Yeah,

equally frustrating, but in different ways. Because for us, like before I even met Brian, so like we’re going back a lot of years, I always bought re refillable spice containers. So I had a selection of spice containers, and then I just buy like bulk spices in bags and go in like that, and I replace it, which is awesome.

Kathi Lipp (04:44)

Okay?

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, okay.

Tonya Kubo (05:06)

They have a little label on them. They’re beautiful, except for the cumin, which somehow got too close to a burner is halfway melted. But aside from that one, right? It’s beautiful. But the problem is I don’t actually have enough. think I have 24, which works for like the main spices. But you know, Mr. Kubo is a big fan of the Trader Joe’s seasoning blends. And I am not devoting a label to

Kathi Lipp (05:08)

Mm-hmm.

Right.

yeah, I get it.

Tonya Kubo (05:34)

a seasoning blend that may or may not have a long time shelf life in our house. And I already have my other ones full.

Kathi Lipp (05:42)

Yes, and you know, I just saw a TikTok where a woman who’s neurodivergent has a Trader Joe’s spice. I think it was the pizza spice that they just discontinued and she was heartbroken. And yes, I can see not wanting to dedicate a whole label to something because you’re not, you’re not.

Tonya Kubo (05:47)

Mm-hmm.

Okay.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Kathi Lipp (06:08)

discontinuing basil. Like, yes.

Tonya Kubo (06:11)

Right, well exactly.

And like a lot of mine are like single spices or single herbs, right? And so with the blends, it doesn’t make sense to put the blends in there, because we go through various blends. And then we’re back to the issue that I think you were alluding to, right? So I’ve got some that are like in the little tiny short containers, like the half an ounce or whatever. Then I’ve got some that are in that four ounce container.

Kathi Lipp (06:16)

Mm-hmm. Yes.

Right.

Mm-hmm. Right.

Mm-hmm.

Tonya Kubo (06:37)

Then I’ve

got some we’ve gotten from Costco, right? So they’re ginormous and they barely fit in the cabinet. And part of it is I have to rely on my memory to let me know like, okay, am I looking in my refillable spices? Do I look in the cabinet or do I look in the drawer? Three locations, Kathi, three. For spices.

Kathi Lipp (06:41)

Yeah.

Right. Right.

I get it

for spices. It should not be this much drama. But if you like to cook or you’re forced to cook, spices make everything better. And so we’re gonna need to figure out this spice situation, right?

Tonya Kubo (07:14)

Mm hmm. Yeah. We and well, we need to figure it out. And I think what, Kathi, we owe it to our listeners to give them a variety of options. Right. And so I think what we can do is I think we have enough time before we cut to commercial to go through a couple of options and then we’ll take our break. How does that sound?

Kathi Lipp (07:26)

Yes, absolutely.

Okay,

I think that sounds beautiful. Okay, so the first thing I think you need to do is we need to declutter your spices and people, know, declutter your spices. But I’m guessing if you do any amount of cooking, you have a couple of basils, you have a spice that you tried from Trader Joe’s and you realized it’s nobody’s favorite or

Tonya Kubo (07:45)

Mm-hmm.

Can I tell

you which one that is? Trader Joe’s seasoning salt. It is the worst thing I’ve ever tasted and I figured out why. It has a bunch of celery salt that, and in my mouth, celery salt tastes bitter. I like celery, but celery salt is very bitter to me, overpowers the whole thing. I hate it.

Kathi Lipp (08:04)

Yeah, do tell.

really?

Okay.

Yeah. Okay. and you,

yeah. Okay. See guys, if you don’t like celery salt, Tonya just saved you four bucks. And yes. So again, you guys know I’m not a huge fan of pull everything into the middle of the room and sort it out, but we are talking microspaces here. Your spices in most houses are microspaces.

Tonya Kubo (08:43)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (08:47)

So I am going to encourage you to take everything out of the cabinet and I want you to do some things like check for expiration dates. Now, I will say this. I’m not worried if your cilantro is expired. The only thing, you you’re not going to die of cilantro poisoning as far as I know, but your spices get less effective the older they are.

Tonya Kubo (09:14)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (09:16)

So if you can’t smell the spice, you need to toss it. If you have six basils, maybe take a couple of unopened ones to the food pantry or give them to a friend or something like that. And then one thing you can do, you can group them. Now, I’ll tell you how I group mine. I have a couple of different ways. So we have your basic set of spices and then I have my blends.

So I have two different areas for that. So my basil is not, my basil spice is not next to my bohemian spice because the bohemian is a blend, the basil is a regular. you know, so there’s herbs, ground spices, baking essential, and also let’s keep the things that we use the most towards the front. So if you have a cabinet or something like that, but,

Tonya Kubo (09:56)

Mm.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (10:14)

Here’s why we’re gonna go through so many different iterations of space spice organization is because in every place I’ve lived I’ve had to organize differently because my kitchen layout has been different and you just have to work with what you have because none of us here are Remodeling our kitchen cabinets because of basil. We’re just not doing it so

Tonya Kubo (10:25)

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Kathi Lipp (10:39)

The first thing I want to talk about is a tiered shelf or expandable rack. So this is very simple. This is part of my solution. This is part of the solution I have for things like my vanilla bean paste and my I have a cinnamon shaker and I have a powdered sugar shaker and I have baking soda and baking powder and all these different kinds of things.

Tonya Kubo (10:52)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (11:06)

And those are not going to fit into my spice rack situation, but they do fit on these tiered, think of them as stairs. And so if you were putting your humans on the stairs, you could put tall people in the back and then shorter people up front. But even if they were kind of the same height, you’d still be able to see the people in the back because they’re on a taller step. That’s the same thing I do.

Tonya Kubo (11:16)

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm, right. Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (11:34)

Some of my spice blends and things like that that they’re a little bit bigger a little bit more awkward You these come in bamboo and by the way, we’ll have links to all of these You know Amazon links to all of these in the back mine are white plastic and they expand so they fit into the space in your cabinet and Yeah, it makes it so you can see everything at a glance. So like I have some barbecue seasonings there

things like that that I don’t use all the time, but I want to know about. And so we’ll put those links in there.

Tonya Kubo (12:12)

Awesome. my gosh, this is so helpful, Kathi. And especially, I really liked the idea of keeping the, I’ll call them the single ingredient spices separate from the blends. Cause I think that is incredibly helpful. So, okay. So you’ve told us like we first got to declutter. We got to pair it down, consolidate, toss, whatever you need to do, but let’s pair it down so that we don’t have six basil. Cause that

Kathi Lipp (12:23)

He has.

Yes.

Mm-hmm. Yep.

Mm-hmm.

Tonya Kubo (12:41)

would be a problem for most of us, maybe not all of us. Then you talked about the of the simplest storage solution it sounds to me is this expandable like shelf sort of stair step thing. Do you feel like it’s the most affordable solution too?

Kathi Lipp (12:48)

Yeah.

Right?

Oh yeah, by far the most affordable. You I think those things you can buy them for like 10 to $13 and that’s really gonna amp up your space. But I think the next most affordable one is, and here’s the thing, I would never personally use this solution. Cause I feel like a kitchen drawer is about the most valuable space in your entire house. But I know for some people, this is the magical solution. And this is, it’s a pullout spice drawer.

Tonya Kubo (13:12)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (13:25)

or you know, what it does is you can pull out the drawer, the spices are laying down in the drawer, but they are segmented out. so there are a couple of pullout drawers we can talk about. That’s one where you can pull out just one of your cabinet drawers or your kitchen drawers and those spices are laying down. There’s another one that I think is really interesting.

Tonya Kubo (13:35)

Hmm.

Kathi Lipp (13:51)

that I have not tried, but I might at some point, especially in our RV where space is limited. And this is like, it’s a pull-out, and we’ll have pictures of all of these in the notes, but this is like a pull-out cabinet, pull-out rack where the spices are standing up. So you can, it’s both sides, it’s like toy soldier rows of spices where you can see them standing up.

Tonya Kubo (13:54)

Mm-hmm.

Okay,

so it goes in a cabinet, but it’s a drawer system that fits inside a cabinet versus having an organization system that fits inside of a drawer.

Kathi Lipp (14:22)

Yes.

Exactly. there I’ve I’ve confused us. I get it. I really have Yes

Tonya Kubo (14:32)

No, it’s okay. I summarized it. We’re good. This is the

beauty of having two of us here. Well, and the reason I wanted to pull that out and clarify is because I think there are a lot of people who do prefer some kind of drawer based system. So having a solution for the people who do want to use their own drawer, right? But make that work for them is helpful. And then also for somebody who

Kathi Lipp (14:50)

Yes.

Yes. Right.

Tonya Kubo (15:00)

maybe has a little extra cabinet space, but that doesn’t work for them because they don’t like the cabinet layout, then they can get a drawer system to insert. my gosh, this is really actually, it’s quite creative, Kathi.

Kathi Lipp (15:06)

Right.

Yes.

Mm-hmm. I

I really I I think if you can solve this problem You can improve your nighttime cooking routine by a solid seven percent Yes, yes

Tonya Kubo (15:24)

Ooh, I like a solid 7%. Not too high,

not too low. This is good. Okay, let’s cut to commercial really quick. Pay some bills. We’ll be right back.

my gosh. So we are back talking about, think one of the most valuable pieces of real estate in your home, which is the space you allocate to spices. Cause it seems like a small space, but it can get out of hand really, really quickly. And Kathi is walking us through a variety of solutions on how to tame that incredibly chaotic area. So you heard us before the commercial break. Now we’re coming back. Kathi.

Kathi Lipp (15:48)

Mm-hmm.

Tonya Kubo (16:05)

Talk to me about what I think is everybody’s practice when it comes to organizing. I think most of our listeners are probably already shocked that we haven’t brought it up.

Kathi Lipp (16:17)

Are you talking lazy Susans? Okay, and I will say this is part of my, I apparently, I don’t think I realized it until we did this episode that I have like a five, five layer solution to all of this, but it’s just, it’s where we’re at. It’s what works. And so I have a lazy Susan, very tall lazy Susan that I keep things like, you know, the Costco size,

Tonya Kubo (16:19)

I’m totally talking lazy Susans.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, it’s what works.

Kathi Lipp (16:46)

containers of They’re the blends, you know, so the those kind of things. I keep them on the lazy Susan. I also keep some other You know like seasoning salts and things like that on there and that is just you know You turn around you’re doubling or tripling your space The problem is whatever on the inside of that lazy Susan will never be seen again Yeah, so you either you either have to not care about it

Tonya Kubo (16:59)

Mm-hmm.

I was gonna say it never sees the light of day.

Kathi Lipp (17:16)

or you just have to promise yourself that you’re not gonna fill up that space. But really, where is there a space in your kitchen that has not been filled?

Tonya Kubo (17:24)

Never. Now I have a question about the lazy Susan though. So my experience with lazy Susans, it doesn’t take long before eventually they don’t quite spin as smoothly as they used to. And so then that’s what drives me up a wall. Cause I’m like, I have what looks like a lazy Susan, but it is not lazying around for me.

Kathi Lipp (17:25)

Right. Yes.

Okay.

Mm-hmm Yes, okay

So you may have to turn that thing take everything off turn it upside down and see if there’s anything blocking the mechanism Or you mention may just have too much on it Yeah, and it’s well it’s probably too stuffed and it’s getting stuck in a corner or something and so maybe you just need a little TLC

Tonya Kubo (17:50)

Hmm.

it never occurred to me that that could be a problem, but that’s probably the problem.

Mm-hmm.

Alright, okay, so, lazy Susan, what else do we got?

Kathi Lipp (18:09)

Yeah,

okay, so if you are super super tight on space in your kitchen So these are some I’m gonna give you some rapid-fire solutions that I have used in spaces like Our RV where there there is no space the space doesn’t exist. So one of those things is There are under cabinet Storage for yeah, so you can see all that. I think that that is ideal for somebody who says

Tonya Kubo (18:15)

Mm-hmm.

Hmm.

Mmm.

Kathi Lipp (18:38)

here are the eight spices I’m going to use. I am not bringing blends into my kitchen. I will make the blend. So that’s an option for that. Another thing that you might want to consider is a holder for the side of your refrigerator. If many refrigerators are not magnetized on the front anymore,

Tonya Kubo (18:43)

Right.

Kathi Lipp (19:03)

but they are on the side. And so there are so many great storage solutions. So if you’re working in a tiny apartment or an RV, or maybe it’s a work kitchen cabinet, and you just have a little bit of space, one of those magnetized things will help it so you don’t lose that shelf in your kitchen that is so, so valuable. So something along those lines, thinking outside the box is really, really helpful in those situations.

Tonya Kubo (19:16)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah,

well, I mean, exactly, right? It’s like, you really just have to look at your kitchen and go, you know, what, what is my usable space and what makes the most sense to put here and be willing to be creative. Cause to your point, I’ve seen a lot of knife organizers, for instance, that could go on the side of the fridge, that are magnetized side of the fridge or side of the stove. And of course these are for people who do not have children. Cause I could just see how that would work.

Kathi Lipp (19:38)

Mm-hmm.

Right. Yeah.

Exactly.

Abby.

Tonya Kubo (20:02)

But just be exactly. But

you know what? Spices could be a safe thing to magnetize to the side of my fridge. So I love that creativity. But I hear a rumor that maybe Roger told me, maybe Roger didn’t tell me, who knows, that you have actually a super duper favorite solution to spice organization. Lay it on us.

Kathi Lipp (20:08)

Yeah. Right.

We’re

my goodness.

You know can spice organization actually be life-changing. I don’t know But if it could be this would be the one it’s from a brand called utopia and it’s not it’s y-o-u like you topia and It is I it’s so interesting. So it’s a plastic Set of shelves that when you pull it out when you pull out a shelf

Tonya Kubo (20:32)

You

Okay.

Kathi Lipp (20:56)

it drops down so you can see all of the spices on that shelf. And of course, I’ve labeled the edge of each shelf so I know what’s on there. But this, it lays it out so beautifully. You know I do a cooking show every Wednesday on Facebook. And I love it. Every time I need a spice, I can just go there and I know I have it. And so part of

Tonya Kubo (21:21)

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (21:25)

keeping that system working. I have one for my basic like basil and then I have another set that is for my blends like Bohemian. And I love it so much because I can see at a glance what I have. I keep those at least two thirds full. I feel like that’s kind of the, that’s when I need, I know I need to get something else unless it’s a crazy expensive spice like saffron.

Tonya Kubo (21:31)

Mm-hmm.

Okay.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Kathi Lipp (21:55)

Saffron,

you know, if we’re gonna wait till we get down to the bottom before we’re my goodness, right? Because yeah, that’s a different tax bracket if you are or you live in a different country where saffron is not quite that expensive Yeah that and vanilla holy cow, but I love this so much. It makes it so much It’s so easy. You can see what you have at a glance It doesn’t matter that I buy some of my spices from savory spice

Tonya Kubo (22:00)

The last thread!

is easier to get.

Kathi Lipp (22:24)

and some of them from Whole Foods and some of them from Safeway because nobody sees them but me. I just keep them all behind there and it fits most of your containers. So I do have a couple where I’ve doubled up on some of those little containers and it just looks it looks nice and it makes me it makes me smile every time I use it.

Tonya Kubo (22:31)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, well, and I think that’s important, right? Because if we have to eat, I mean, the truth is, is we have to eat, we don’t necessarily have to cook. But if we have to eat and we choose to cook, we should have a measure of enjoyment in the cooking experience. And to your earlier point, the frustration, having like the spices fall out on you or fall onto the cabinet when you’re trying to get to something that really can take, even if you enjoy cooking, that can rob the joy from.

Kathi Lipp (22:56)

Right.

Mm-hmm.

Yes, yes.

It really can.

Tonya Kubo (23:17)

So now I have a hard question, Kathi, because you know me, I like to throw you curve balls now and then. You have laid out a lot of solutions and you know, our listeners and our Facebook community members, we struggle a little bit with some decision fatigue. Notice how I put myself in that picture just now? Yeah, I said we, it wasn’t the royal we. And so with so many choices, how do you help us decide?

Kathi Lipp (23:20)

Okay, I love a good hard question. Let’s do it.

Mm-hmm.

Sure. Yes.

I can actually answer this pretty easily. You need a tape measure. You need a tape measure. Yes, but you know what? The tape measure helps you decide what actually is going to work for your space. And so you may think, youtopia that Kathi’s talking about, that will change my life. And then you go to measure your cabinet and you’re like, it would change my life if it fit, but it doesn’t.

Tonya Kubo (23:47)

Okay.

That was not what I saw coming, but okay.

Hmm.

Yeah

Kathi Lipp (24:13)

So

I’m not going, so you can do this through process of elimination. So get a tape measure out, check these links that we’re sharing with you on Amazon and see what will actually fit for your space. And I would just say, give yourself a half inch grace on most of these things because not that I think they’re lying to you, but just to make sure that it can fit well. And really consider a combination. What I’ve really used,

Tonya Kubo (24:17)

Mmm.

Kathi Lipp (24:43)

is the youtopia spice organizers, the lazy Susan, and the stair stepping shelves. And that fits all of my needs. And if I can’t fit it in one of those things, I probably don’t need it. It would be a very rare thing that I would need something outside of.

Tonya Kubo (24:50)

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. And I think that’s just a great thing to remember. It’s like, if this doesn’t work, like, first of all, how likely is it that the solution wouldn’t work? And if it didn’t work, what would be the circumstance that would make that the case? And then how do you work around it? my goodness, Kathi. Okay. So I feel like it is important to remind our listeners of all the resources that are available. We have mentioned a lot of things in this episode. Please do not walk, but run over to the show notes.

Kathi Lipp (25:17)

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Yeah.

Tonya Kubo (25:32)

Click the link that’s in your player and you want to definitely pay attention to all the resources that we have for you there. So we will give you a link to the Clutterfree Academy Facebook group just in case you want to talk this through, share some before and after pictures, see other people’s before and after pictures. We will have a link to a downloadable PDF resource for you and a quick spice checklist. This whole series includes

resources that you can download and print out or use on your device, whatever makes you happy. And Kathi mentioned this, but she kind of snuck it under, so I want to reinforce it. You can catch her cooking live on Facebook. That is her author, Kathi Lipp page, every Wednesday. If you just go to the page, it’ll tell you what time the next one is. And you can see her kitchen live and in real time.

Kathi Lipp (26:22)

Yeah, and here, let me just give one more little piece of encouragement here. When you are looking at ordering these things, look on Amazon and oftentimes there will be a note that this item is often returned. Now, it always blew me away that the reviews are like a 4.7, but the item is often returned.

Tonya Kubo (26:41)

Mmm.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (26:49)

and

that’s because people ordered it and it didn’t fit in their kitchen. we, know, us cluttery girls, we love to take a flyer and just, you know, we want to order when the mood hits us and we can’t find the tape measure, so we’re not gonna worry about it. Take the extra five seconds to go find that tape, or five minutes, let’s be honest. Go find that tape measure, measure the space, so.

Tonya Kubo (26:53)

Yep.

Kathi Lipp (27:15)

because I want you to have wins. Tonya and I want you to have wins in every part of this. And I’m also gonna say one other thing. Tonya, you and I both do an extreme amount of cooking. Most of the food we eat, we cook. You and I both buy spices from Costco. Don’t buy spices from Costco if you’re not cooking on the regular. I will say, I guess there is another portion to my spice.

Tonya Kubo (27:26)

Mm-hmm. Yep.

Kathi Lipp (27:43)

You know what I’m holding on to to those really big jars I keep those in my garage and when I’m refilling my spice containers one thing I’ve discovered I don’t know if this holds true for you. I’m never shaking spices into a soup or a casserole I’m always measuring them. So I take those stupid little shaker tabs off Because I don’t use them but when I refill I refill with a piece of paper that I’ve fashioned into a cone because

Tonya Kubo (27:58)

Mm.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (28:11)

If I’m refilling spices, I’m refilling a lot at the same time. And I don’t want my basil to get into my cumin, or let’s be honest, more likely the other way around. And so I’m just using that paper to do it over and over and over again. So those are my last little hits.

Tonya Kubo (28:19)

Mm-hmm.

I love it. I

have a little itty bitty baby funnel. It is the tiniest cutest funnel you’ll ever see. Can’t tell you where I bought it, but it works really well. All right. Well, Kathi, thank you so much for sharing these tips with us, helping us to spice up our kitchens. And listeners, I just want to say thank you for hanging out with us. We appreciate the fact that you lend us your ears. You have been listening to Clutterfree Academy. Now go create the clutter free life you’ve always wanted to live.

Kathi Lipp (28:30)

do you? Yes. I love that.

I love it.

Woohoo!

#667 – Clutter Free Finances: Taking Control of Subscriptions

Apr 29, 2025 | Clutter Free, Clutter Free For Life, Clutter Free Home, Clutter Free Podcast, Finances, Mental Load, Overwhelmed, Podcast

On this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo dive deep into the world of subscription services and the hidden costs they can incur over time. As many of us fall into the habit of acquiring more subscriptions than we need, our finances begin to...

#666 – The Nightstand Reset: Creating a Launch Pad for Peace

Apr 22, 2025 | Clutter Free, Clutter Free For Life, Clutter Free Home, Clutter Free Podcast, Home, Organizing, Overwhelmed, Podcast

In this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo delve into the importance of a tidy nightstand for a better night's sleep and a more organized life. They discuss Kathi's recent purchase of new nightstands with built-in outlets, her nighttime routine...

#665 – Declutter Your Spice Cabinet: From Chaos to Cooking Bliss

Apr 15, 2025 | Clutter Free, Clutter Free For Life, Clutter Free Home, Clutter Free Podcast, Home, Podcast, tips and ideas

In this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo tackle one of the most deceptively frustrating spots in your kitchen: the spice cabinet. If you’ve ever bought a second (or sixth) bottle of basil because you couldn’t find the first one, or had cumin...

#655 Finding Grace in Your Imperfect Space: A Conversation with Hilary Bernstein

by Clutter Free Academy Team | Feb 4, 2025 | Clutter Free, Clutter Free For Life, Clutter Free Home, Clutter Free Podcast, Finances, Freedom, Mental Load, Organizing, Overwhelmed, Podcast | 0 comments

#655 Finding Grace in Your Imperfect Space: A Conversation with Hilary Bernstein

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Hey there, friend!

Are you caught in the tension between wanting a perfect home and feeling overwhelmed by the impossibility of achieving it? In this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp sits down with Hilary Bernstein, author of “The Tension of Tidy,” to explore the connection between perfectionism and our struggle with clutter.

Learn why perfectionists often have the hardest time maintaining an organized home and discover practical strategies for breaking free from the paralysis of perfectionism. Hilary shares insights about finding God’s grace in our imperfect spaces and offers hope for those caught between Pinterest-perfect expectations and real-life limitations.

In this episode, you’ll discover:

– Why perfectionism often leads to cluttered spaces

– How to celebrate small wins in home management

– Practical first steps for overwhelmed perfectionists

– Biblical perspective on imperfect spaces

– Permission to invite people into your imperfect home

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Sabbath Soup: Weekly Menus and Rhythms to Make Space for a Day of Rest

Kathi Lipp gives readers an easy-to-follow process for meal planning and prep, so that they can enjoy a full day each week of real rest and refreshment.

Could you use a break from cooking (and everything else) once a week? Not only is rest vital for your mind and body, it’s good for your soul too. God designed us to enter into Sabbath rest one day per week, but as you know, meals still need to be made. Your family still needs to be fed.

Sabbath Soup includes convenient, seasonal meal plans that take the guesswork out of shopping and cooking. More than just a collection of delicious recipes—including main dishes, breads, breakfasts, desserts, salads, sides, and yes, soups—this is your guide to establishing a weekly rhythm and routine of meal planning and prep that allows you to have a true day off.

Do something good for your soul and experience the peace that comes with a full day dedicated to spending time with God, family, and friends. Savor your Sabbath as you proudly proclaim, “Soup’s on!”

Order your copy of Sabbath Soup: Weekly Menus and Rhythms to Make Space for a Day of Rest here.

Links Mentioned:

Hilary Bernstein’s book “The Tension of Tidy“
Hilary Bernstein’s website

Clutter Free Resources:

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Meet Our Guest

Hilary Bernstein

Hilary Bernstein is the women’s ministry director at The Chapel in Green, Ohio, where she brings a wealth of experience from her roles as a blogger, newspaper editor, and columnist. A prolific author, Bernstein, has recently published Prayerful Living and twelve other impactful devotional books. More information can be found at hilarybernstein.com.

Transcript

Kathi Lipp (00:10)
Well, hey friends, welcome to Clutter-Free Academy, where our goal is to help you take small, doable steps to live every day with less clutter and more life. And I am here with the Clutter-Free queen. It is Tonya Kubo. Hey, Tonya. Okay, we don’t often do top 10 lists, but we’re doing a top 10 list today. I, so this is a two-parter. The first part is 10 things I don’t do now that I live clutter-free.

Tonya Kubo (00:24)
Hey Kathi

Kathi Lipp (00:40)
And next week, we’re going to talk about 10 things I do now that I live clutter free. And so I want to talk to you about how your life has changed, the things that you have stopped. And I just realized I told you we were going to do exactly the opposite podcast, but you know what? We’re we’re just fine. We’re just rolling with it. You know, we’re going to live in the moment here. And so I’m going to get us kicked off because I I think

Tonya Kubo (00:53)
Okay.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (01:10)
People would not recognize my life From before clutter free now clutter free has not always I did not say hey I’m gonna start something called clutter free and now I’m gonna change my life like I changed my life and Then I thought I’m not the only one like this I wrote a book called clutter free and then I met my friend Tonya Kubo who seemed like the most put-together human being on the planet, but told me no

Tonya Kubo (01:21)
No.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (01:39)
her life was a mess too, and we started to figure all this stuff out together. And what a gift that was because as much as the book helped people, I know that our Clutter-Free Academy, Clutter-Free for Life and this podcast have helped just exponentially more people. I really, people don’t believe that I was cluttery at one point. And I’m like, no, I’m still cluttery at some points, but.

Tonya Kubo (01:57)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah,

still cluttering. Yeah.

Kathi Lipp (02:09)
I’m not afraid

to invite you into my house. So I wanted to talk about what are some key things that look different now than they did when I was clutter free. number one, I don’t save up decluttering for the weekends. And this has been a huge shift for me because I would always think as I’ve…

Tonya Kubo (02:12)
Mm-hmm.

Mmm.

Kathi Lipp (02:32)
pretty much always been a Monday through Friday, nine to five kind of person and who actually works nine to five. Let’s be clear, it’s eight to six. But I’ve pretty much been that person my whole life and I was just so busy during the week that I’m like, I’m just gonna save all this up for the weekends. And I don’t live like that anymore. Like as I am leaving a room, I’m like, are there things I can grab to throw away, to put away, to declutter?

Tonya Kubo (02:39)
Yeah.

Kathi Lipp (03:00)
Is that similar for you?

Tonya Kubo (03:03)
Yeah, I mean, I still think, you know, because my kids are younger, right? Like our house is always in some state of shambles, but you know, little things that I used to on Fridays clean off my desk, for instance. And now it’s just at the end of the day, right? It just is so much easier to take like a handful of stuff at the end of each day than to have to make multiple trips every Friday.

Kathi Lipp (03:06)
Yes.

Mm-hmm.

Right.

It makes such a difference, right? Because I don’t know, there’s just something about like, I’ve saved this up for an entire week. You know, instead of just saying, okay, a little bit of time, a little bit of time, my brain has shifted into small amounts of decluttering instead of huge mountains of decluttering. Okay, so that’s number one. Tonya, we’re going back and forth. Tonya, what’s number two?

Tonya Kubo (03:33)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Right?

Kathi Lipp (03:54)
something that you don’t do now that you live clutter-free.

Tonya Kubo (03:57)
Okay, so this might seem silly, but I genuinely used to think unloading the dishwasher took 30 minutes and now I realize it takes about three and a half. So I don’t put off unloading the dishwasher till the weekend. Like seriously, I made it into such a big job in my head and I don’t need more.

Kathi Lipp (04:11)
Right?

Yeah, yes,

I feel like doing the dishes could take a half hour if you’ve got a lot of dishes piled up if you have things that need to be soaked like, you know, deep, deep scrub. Right.

Tonya Kubo (04:24)
Right, but I didn’t say doing the dishes, Kathi. I just

said unload the dishwasher.

Kathi Lipp (04:30)
just thinking maybe that’s why your brain was playing tricks on you and here’s what I know is when you when you unload the dishes here’s the magical thing it’s easier to load the dishes I know that seems like it should be obvious but our cluttery people will get that

Tonya Kubo (04:42)
Right.

Yeah, no, exactly, exactly.

Kathi Lipp (04:49)
Yeah, okay. Number three, I don’t stand next to the gas pump while it’s filling up. I, okay, so I think a lot of our cluttering friends will get this. I went, those small moments, like just like you were talking about with the microwave, I unload the dishwasher in the two and a half minutes that my, or I at least get it started in the two and a half minutes that my oatmeal is cooking.

Tonya Kubo (05:01)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (05:18)
And

so now I am married to somebody who does quiet contemplation while his coffee is warming up. And I’m like, you know what, we just live different lives. while I’m pumping my gas, I clean out the car. I just grab a few things. I throw them into the garbage. I feel like that’s free garbage. Garbage is such a big deal up here.

Tonya Kubo (05:24)
Hahaha

Right.

Mm-hmm.

Yes,

it is free garbage. I am right there with you.

Kathi Lipp (05:45)
It makes me so happy. I can’t even stand it. Yeah, I’m never somebody who would bring garbage from my house to throw away. I’ve heard of people doing that. I know. But if I’ve got a McDonald’s cup, that that’s going in the garbage while I’m pumping. It is I’m doing all the things and even like our truck takes a long time to fill up. I have been known to we have a like a hand vac in the truck.

Tonya Kubo (05:53)
Right. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yup.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (06:14)
and I’ve been known to like vacuum things out while I’m doing, yeah, it makes me so happy I can’t even stand it. Okay, but I’m doing, what the core concept behind that is it just takes a moment to make a small difference. And like you just said with the unloading dishwasher and even with the, I don’t save up decluttering for the weekends. If I can do a little bit each day, man, the weekends can be for.

Tonya Kubo (06:17)
Nice.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (06:42)
fun or bigger projects or things like that. Okay, number four, Tonya, what’s something that you don’t do now that you’re living clutter free?

Tonya Kubo (06:44)
Mm-hmm.

I don’t go shopping when I’m tired, hungry, or frustrated.

Kathi Lipp (06:56)
That’s my favorite time to go shopping. Okay, tell me more. Right.

Tonya Kubo (06:58)
It’s everybody’s favorite time to go shopping.

Right. But I mean, something that I learned early on in my clutter free journey is that when I’m tired, I’m hungry or I’m frustrated, my tolerance, like my my impulse control is lower and my desire to soothe is higher. And so I feel like everything I see at the store is going to make me feel better. And it is not.

Kathi Lipp (07:16)
Yeah.

Mmm, good.

Right.

Tonya Kubo (07:26)
to make me feel better. I am still going to leave the store tired, hungry, and frustrated so I may as well just solve those problems before I go.

Kathi Lipp (07:33)
Okay, can I tell you how I’m even worse at this and it’s something I need to correct in my own life. So I go to the store, which is a chore, right? That is an errand. Right. And I feel like because I have done that, even when I was living in San Jose and things were like five minutes, like, look at me checking things off of my list. I deserve a little treat, a little treaty treat. Can we just say that shopping and Target

Tonya Kubo (07:42)
Yeah, it’s a jaunt for you. It’s a jaunt.

Hahaha

Kathi Lipp (08:02)
It’s so much better when you have Starbucks. And so like this is the thinking I have to unpack all the time in my cluttery journey. it just, makes a difference. It makes a difference when you say, and I just, but I try not to go, I pack snacks now in our car so that we are not so tempted.

Tonya Kubo (08:05)
I’m sure it is, I’m sure it is.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (08:32)
Like it’s okay every once in a while to go to Starbucks, but you don’t get Starbucks every time you leave the house. Yes, okay. And so tired, hungry, frustrated will lead you to, and here’s the other part of that that I think is you’re so wise because I’ll just throw things in my cart and I’ll say I’ll return them later if I’m frustrated. Like, you know, don’t go shopping for jeans when you’re tired, frustrated or hungry. That’s just the meanest thing you could do to yourself.

Tonya Kubo (08:32)
Yeah.

Mmm.

No.

Kathi Lipp (09:00)
but then I’ll buy all the jeans and then I’m like, now I have to take them back. And then like, I already have a return right now of a shirt and it’s, we’re recording this around Christmas time. And I’m like, the last thing I want to do on earth is go into a store and return a shirt. Like I can’t think of anything I want to do less. Okay. Number five, I don’t leave a room without scanning the room. So.

Tonya Kubo (09:04)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Hmm

Kathi Lipp (09:27)
What that means is I don’t, I don’t just walk into another room. I will walk into another room, but I will grab the dish that’s on my desk. I will grab the shirt that needs to be returned. Can you tell I’m going through stuff? I will grab the jacket that needs to be hung downstairs. And here’s why I think that this matters. Even if I’m just going into Roger’s office, which is still on the top of the floor.

I’ll move those things to the top of the stairs so that I used to think if I’m gonna do something, I need to do it all the way. And no, I just need to push it forward. I need to push that chore forward. And that makes a huge difference. It’s like, even if I can’t unload the entire dishwasher while my oatmeal is cooking, I’m pushing it forward enough and I’m yelling up to Roger,

Tonya Kubo (10:00)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (10:26)
The dishes are clean, I’m just not done yet. And so he knows not to put dirty dishes in there. But if you can push it forward, then the next time you’re reheating your coffee, you can push it forward another minute and you might get it done. And so scanning a room, seeing what can I push into place? Because here’s what I know, if I leave it all until I have time, then I’m gonna spend half a day going up and down the stairs. And that sounds like my worst nightmare, I hate that stuff.

Tonya Kubo (10:29)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Kathi Lipp (10:56)
Yeah, okay. So we have gone through our top five. We’re gonna take a quick break, pay some bills. We’re gonna come back and Tonya is gonna talk about how she doesn’t apologize. I can’t wait to hear about how you do this. Teach me, Obi-Wan. We’ll be right back. Okay, guys, we are back with 10 things I don’t do now that I live clutter free. So Tonya, you say you don’t apologize. For what?

Tonya Kubo (11:23)
I

apologize for the condition of my house.

Kathi Lipp (11:26)
So tell me more. Tell me how I can get brave and be really like, just come on in.

Tonya Kubo (11:33)
well, just stop doing it. I mean, that’s how I did it, right? It was like a cold turkey. Like, I think there was a bit of a transition of where I would say, I probably should apologize for the state of my house, but I won’t. But I just don’t. And, you know, some people come in and say stuff and some people don’t, and I don’t really care. Because what I realize is we all have a different standard. You know, I used to apologize. And I realized that a lot of people

Kathi Lipp (11:37)
wow.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Tonya Kubo (12:03)
Like, first of all, I would apologize after spending hours doing a crisis clean because I knew other people would come in and like, and feel like my house was in complete disarray. And I was like, why am I acting like I didn’t just kill myself to make this house look nicer? And then I got to where, you know what? What do I care? mean, people come in, sometimes people are like, wow, you must be really busy. I am. That’s not untrue. I am really busy.

Kathi Lipp (12:13)
Mmm.

Right, right.

It’s a great friend test, right? Can we hang? Can we hang? Yeah.

Tonya Kubo (12:33)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, but I’m just

like, there’s nothing they could say that’s probably not true to some degree. And I’ve had like repair guys come in, it’s funny, is because the repair guys will come in and our front room doesn’t have flooring. We tore up the flooring and then building costs went up so we have not replaced the flooring. And they’ll go to put the booties on them like, yeah, that’s cute. You don’t have to do that here. And they’ll look around and they’re like, okay.

Kathi Lipp (12:49)
All right. Yeah.

Tonya Kubo (13:01)
Every now and then they’ll say, are you sure? Like, yeah, no, we’re good here.

Kathi Lipp (13:06)
Yeah.

Well, it’s so true. Our lives are all in transition, right? And when you have kids, the amount of day-to-day clutter goes up exponentially. Or maybe you’re in the midst of a big project. You know, I’ll never forget during the launch of Clutter Free, book, the state my house was in. It was like, we can’t take any pictures. And just recently,

Tonya Kubo (13:12)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (13:35)
Tenneil who manages our social media said, Kathi, can we get a video of you pushing in a chair? And right now we’re in Christmas crazies. I’m like, it would take me 45 minutes to get to a place to push in a chair. Right, it’s, yeah, because there’s all the fudge making supplies right there, yeah. So are you really, are you using marshmallow fluff in it?

Tonya Kubo (13:45)
No. To push in the chair. You’re like, “‘Cause I can’t get to the chair to push it in.”

Yes, I’m making fudge this weekend too. Anyway, I am.

I am using marshmallow fluff in it. I took a whole class on how to make fudge using marshmallow fluff. It was fun.

Kathi Lipp (14:05)
I saw that I saw that well,

I saw the fudge class. I didn’t know that there was the marshmallow fluff. Yeah, I’m very excited I’m just using a recipe off the internet But as you know, we live next to not next to you know half I don’t know 20 minutes away from a gourmet chocolate shop, which is the only Yeah, they’re a whiner They ship they’re so good but also let’s just say their fudge has gourmet prices and I’m like

Tonya Kubo (14:16)
Mm-hmm.

Little John’s, they ship. Little John’s, you should order from Little John’s.

Yes

Kathi Lipp (14:35)
How much would it cost for me to do this? And Roger’s like, we can buy their other stuff. We never have to buy fudge again. And I was like, I’m an indentured fudge servant now. Got it. Okay. Okay. You know what? It’s good. Hey, speaking of fudge, number seven, I don’t buy all the gear for hobbies unless I have a pattern of doing the hobby. Because here’s what I’ve discovered, Tonya. You know what my hobby is? Buying the stuff for hobbies.

Tonya Kubo (14:44)
Yes, I am too.

Mmm.

I

was gonna say preparing to have a hobby.

Kathi Lipp (15:07)
So here’s what I said, know, like one of the recipes that I am preparing right now called for a candy thermometer. And I’m like, ugh.

Tonya Kubo (15:17)
I need that for the fudge recipe with the marshmallow fluff. You need a candy thermometer.

Kathi Lipp (15:20)
Okay, so here’s what I told

myself if I prepare three recipes right now that don’t require the the thermometer if I if I prepare these three Christmas gift II things then I am allowed to buy a Candy thermometer and I got one by the way Michaels has 30 % off coupons for a while now. So go check that out I got the I think it’s the Wilson one but

Tonya Kubo (15:34)
Mm-hmm.

Ew.

Kathi Lipp (15:49)
I cannot tell you how many hobbies I’ve invested in and had to keep that stuff because I invest I told myself I’ve invested so heavily I need to keep all this stuff. It just it doesn’t make sense and it’s not the right thing. So I no longer I need to have a pattern of Can I start this hobby with stuff I have or can I start this hobby for less than ten dollars? And if I find that I really enjoy it

Tonya Kubo (15:54)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (16:19)
Then I will keep going but I am NOT going to go I’ll just say my history is buying at a professional level and performing at an amateur level like it’s not good

Tonya Kubo (16:30)
I

know that feeling though. If I have the same paints and brushes that Bob Ross has, I will make the same pictures that Bob Ross made.

Kathi Lipp (16:37)
Right.

Right, right.

And you know, our friend Cheri Gregory, friend of the podcast, Cheri Gregory calls it buying to become and I have done that for years and years. Okay, Tonya, number eight.

Tonya Kubo (16:49)
Yeah.

Okay, I kind of stole from you because you said that you scan a room before you leave. Before I go to bed, I make a round through the house specifically for dirty dishes. And here’s my, if I made a round through my house for decluttering, I would never make it to bed. But I can make a pass through my teeny tiny house just for dirty dishes in about 25 minutes. And it makes my life so much easier that

Kathi Lipp (16:58)
Yeah. Yeah.

so smart.

No, of course not.

Hmm

Tonya Kubo (17:24)
Like, know, because all run into bulls, where are all the bulls? The bulls are in the kids’ room underneath the bed. Why are they underneath the bed? I actually can’t answer that question, but that is where I find them.

Kathi Lipp (17:33)
Okay, Tonya, we are missing a bowl right now. There are just two of us. There are just two of us. This giant glass bowl, we cannot find. Is it under Lily’s bed? That’s my question now.

Tonya Kubo (17:36)
Maybe it’s under my bed!

It’s probably under Lily’s bed, and this is the worst of it, right? Is the way that Abby’s bed works, it sits lower to the ground. So Abby shoves stuff underneath Lily’s bed too. It’s not even all Lily’s fault.

Kathi Lipp (17:52)
Ugh.

Poor Lily. I’m sorry Lily. I did not mean to throw you under the bus bus or the bed Okay, so you do so what 25 minutes that seems like a long time so break that down for me Really okay

Tonya Kubo (18:13)
It’s a lot of dishes in my kid’s room and a lot of

dishes by Mr. Kubo’s desk. So it’s two trips. Two to three trips from the girl’s room, two trips from Brian’s desk and then

Kathi Lipp (18:20)
Got it. So you’re having to make multiple trips. Got it. Okay. And then

And and you’re

loading you’re soaking all that. Okay, that makes more sense. Okay Okay, that makes total sense. And I think doing doing a round of dishes I really feel like when everything else in your life falls apart the two things that you need to stay on top of are dishes and laundry because Mm-hmm. Yeah

Tonya Kubo (18:49)
Yes and I will say just really quickly that 25 minutes

does include a good five minute temper tantrum of my gosh what is growing in this thing.

Kathi Lipp (19:00)
I love it. Yeah, the the the Dishes and laundry if you stay on top of those like I don’t care how crunchy your kitchen floor gets I don’t care, you know at the I would say the third thing but this doesn’t have to be done as Much is staying on top of bills. Those are the important things that if you fall behind on them It’s going to be super painful to recover from them

Tonya Kubo (19:01)
That’s in there too.

No.

Mm-hmm. yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (19:25)
But if you can stay on top of those three things, it takes almost the same amount of energy to mop the floor when it’s been a week or five weeks. Like, I don’t want you to have to go five weeks, but if you need to in a crisis, you can. And yeah, and also stay on top of your garbage and recycling. number nine. This is my last thing of things I don’t do now that I live clutter free.

Tonya Kubo (19:37)
Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (19:55)
Okay, I try not to I’m still working through this but I’m much better than I used to be I don’t compare my stuff to my friends stuff so Or stuff on social media. There is always a new thing That would make my life two percent easier or two percent better Not not my entire life if something made my entire life two percent better you bet I’m going to invest in that but like

Tonya Kubo (20:04)
Mmm.

Kathi Lipp (20:25)
Let’s say, know, my, my robot vacuum, there are now robot vacuums that you can control remotely. Like I could be at my mom’s house and now I could get that doesn’t make my life better enough to upgrade my robot. Like my robots fine. We get along. We, she does what she needs to do. I’m sorry. It’s normally a he. I don’t know why I said she, cause I like for all my domestic labor to be he’s.

Tonya Kubo (20:34)
Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (20:55)
Because I just think that’s fair But I Just because somebody else has something that has made their life Infamates Lee better. It doesn’t mean that I need to upgrade it. I I try when I see you wearing a cute sweater I’m not going to say you know what? need that cute sweater. I’m gonna I’m one of things I’m trying to do is go into my own closet

Tonya Kubo (21:09)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (21:22)
and see

my own cute sweaters and the things that make me happy. So I’m trying really hard to reframe what my friends have. And also that can be a form of jealousy. I can just say, you know what? I’m really happy that Tonya has that sweater. I think she looks great in it. She’s having fun with it. And it makes me happy to see her in it. And it doesn’t have to be, I don’t have to own it for it to bring me happiness. So trying to stay out of that comparison trap.

Tonya Kubo (21:33)
Mmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Kathi Lipp (21:52)
And I’m sure when you go into people’s houses that have floors, that can be hard.

Tonya Kubo (21:57)
I do have floor envy right now, I’m not gonna lie. If you’ve got luxury vinyl plank, I’m eyeballing your floors, let me tell ya.

Kathi Lipp (21:59)
I you do.

And I do have that upstairs and I wrestled over that decision for about two years And I’m so glad we pulled the trigger It’s so painful to get flooring done just because of all the moving and shifting and all that kind of stuff Okay, Tonya round out our list. Give us number ten. All right

Tonya Kubo (22:09)
Yeah, no.

It is.

My cluttery peeps will get this. I no longer gain comfort or security from having full shelves, full drawers, etc.

Kathi Lipp (22:33)
yeah, space scares us, doesn’t it? Yeah.

Tonya Kubo (22:37)
Space is scary because space is scarcity and lack and my gosh what

if I don’t have enough. But if things are full even if they’re full of stuff that you haven’t worn in 22 years you believe you have enough clothes if for some reason they stopped making all clothing.

Kathi Lipp (22:48)
Right?

Mm-hmm.

Okay, so Tonya, this is so interesting. A number of people on TikTok and other apps are doing a no buy 2025, right? And the conventional wisdom is declutter your closet so you can see what you have. And then, so you know what you have, because it is, it’s easier to see what you have when you have less stuff in your closet.

Tonya Kubo (23:04)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Kathi Lipp (23:22)
But I heard one woman, I thought this was so interesting. And I’m just gonna throw this out there for your reaction. She goes, I am not decluttering before my 2025. Because when I declutter, I feel like there is empty space. And I feel this urge to fill that space with shopping, with thrifting, with all these other things. So what she is doing is she is.

Tonya Kubo (23:39)
Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (23:50)
putting some of her clothes into another closet, including clothes she likes, so that she will, she remember, I’ve got more stuff. I don’t know, how does that hit you? I thought it was really interesting. Really.

Tonya Kubo (23:53)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

I have a friend who does that actually. she has,

yeah, so she boxes up all of her extra stuff, even if it’s in the current season. And she has it all in like the rafters of her garage. But whenever she’s like, I wanna go shopping, she just goes and she takes a box down and she trades out pieces.

Kathi Lipp (24:10)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

You know, I think it’s really interesting. And so I’m not saying one way is better than the other. I’m going to try the other closet boxing because yeah, when I pull out all my winter stuff, I’m so happy. I’m like, I never need to go shopping again. And then after about two weeks, I’m like, you know, people are really into these green grandpa sweaters and like, okay, Kathi, stop, stop, stop, stop.

Tonya Kubo (24:50)
Yeah,

see, and I’m the person, I want all of my clothing to be able to fit in this much of my closet. Like, I don’t wanna ever change anything out. I don’t wanna work that hard. I’m just so, like, I don’t wanna say lazy, but really it’s just like, that is just something that takes such a high level of perceived energy for me that I’m like, I’m good.

Kathi Lipp (24:56)
Yes, you.

Yeah.

Okay, see, even within our Cluttery community, we all have our own little quirks. And that’s why it’s okay for you to forge your own path, but think about the wisdom that will get you to the next space in your Clutter-free journey. I hope one of these has inspired you today. Tonya, thanks so much for hanging out with me.

Tonya Kubo (25:18)
We do.

Thanks for having me.

Kathi Lipp (25:37)
And friends, thank you for being here. You’ve been listening to Clutter-Free Academy. I’m Kathi Lipp. Now, go create the clutter-free life you always wanted to live.

#667 – Clutter Free Finances: Taking Control of Subscriptions

On this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo dive deep into the world of subscription services and the hidden costs they can incur over time. As many of us fall into the habit of acquiring more subscriptions than we need, our finances begin to...

#666 – The Nightstand Reset: Creating a Launch Pad for Peace

In this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo delve into the importance of a tidy nightstand for a better night's sleep and a more organized life. They discuss Kathi's recent purchase of new nightstands with built-in outlets, her nighttime routine...

#665 – Declutter Your Spice Cabinet: From Chaos to Cooking Bliss

In this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo tackle one of the most deceptively frustrating spots in your kitchen: the spice cabinet. If you’ve ever bought a second (or sixth) bottle of basil because you couldn’t find the first one, or had cumin...

#654 Declutter Your Life: 100 Spaces, 15 Minutes Each

by Roger Lipp | Jan 28, 2025 | Clutter Free, Clutter Free For Life, Clutter Free Home, Clutter Free Podcast, Finances, Freedom, Mental Load, Organizing, Overwhelmed, Podcast | 0 comments

#654 Declutter Your Life: 100 Spaces, 15 Minutes Each

Listen Now

Hey there, friend!

In this episode of Clutter-Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo help listeners kick off 2025 with a practical plan for a clutter-free home. Kathi shares her personal goal of decluttering 100 spaces in her house this year and how she’s breaking it down into manageable, 15-minute tasks.

Tonya adds her insights on avoiding overwhelm and tailoring the process to fit your unique spaces and needs. Whether you prefer a printable checklist or an editable spreadsheet, this episode provides actionable tools and encouragement to get started. Tune in to learn why small steps lead to big results and how to find hidden peace in your home.

Click here to be notified when the next podcast episode is released!

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Sabbath Soup: Weekly Menus and Rhythms to Make Space for a Day of Rest

Kathi Lipp gives readers an easy-to-follow process for meal planning and prep, so that they can enjoy a full day each week of real rest and refreshment.

Could you use a break from cooking (and everything else) once a week? Not only is rest vital for your mind and body, it’s good for your soul too. God designed us to enter into Sabbath rest one day per week, but as you know, meals still need to be made. Your family still needs to be fed.

Sabbath Soup includes convenient, seasonal meal plans that take the guesswork out of shopping and cooking. More than just a collection of delicious recipes—including main dishes, breads, breakfasts, desserts, salads, sides, and yes, soups—this is your guide to establishing a weekly rhythm and routine of meal planning and prep that allows you to have a true day off.

Do something good for your soul and experience the peace that comes with a full day dedicated to spending time with God, family, and friends. Savor your Sabbath as you proudly proclaim, “Soup’s on!”

Order your copy of Sabbath Soup: Weekly Menus and Rhythms to Make Space for a Day of Rest here.

Links Mentioned:

100 Spaces Checklist PDF

Editable Spreadsheet Version

Wallpaper Perforator
Disclosure: This link is an affiliate link, which means if you make a purchase through it, we may earn a small commission at no additional cost to you. Thank you for supporting our work!

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Meet Our Guest

Tonya Kubo

Tonya Kubo is the illustrious and fearless leader of Kathi Lipp’s Clutter Free Academy Facebook group and the Clutter Free for Life membership program. A professional community strategist, she believes everyone deserves to have a place online where they feel like they belong. Raised by a hoarder, Tonya knows firsthand the pain and isolation that comes from living in conditions others don’t understand. She wants better for her family and her cluttery peeps, which is why she is passionate about the compassionate slow-and-steady approach that makes Clutter Free unique. She lives in the heart of California with her husband, Brian, their two spirited daughters, and one very tolerant cat. Visit tonyakubo.com to find out more about her community work, or email her at tonya@kathilipp.org to discuss the Clutter Free Academy podcast and programs.

Transcript

Kathi Lipp (00:10)
Well, hey friends, welcome to Clutter-Free Academy, where our goal is to help you take small, doable steps to live every day with less clutter and more life. And I am here with the Clutter-Free queen. It is Tonya Kubo. Hey, Tonya. Okay, we don’t often do top 10 lists, but we’re doing a top 10 list today. I, so this is a two-parter. The first part is 10 things I don’t do now that I live clutter-free.

Tonya Kubo (00:24)
Hey Kathi

Kathi Lipp (00:40)
And next week, we’re going to talk about 10 things I do now that I live clutter free. And so I want to talk to you about how your life has changed, the things that you have stopped. And I just realized I told you we were going to do exactly the opposite podcast, but you know what? We’re we’re just fine. We’re just rolling with it. You know, we’re going to live in the moment here. And so I’m going to get us kicked off because I I think

Tonya Kubo (00:53)
Okay.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (01:10)
People would not recognize my life From before clutter free now clutter free has not always I did not say hey I’m gonna start something called clutter free and now I’m gonna change my life like I changed my life and Then I thought I’m not the only one like this I wrote a book called clutter free and then I met my friend Tonya Kubo who seemed like the most put-together human being on the planet, but told me no

Tonya Kubo (01:21)
No.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (01:39)
her life was a mess too, and we started to figure all this stuff out together. And what a gift that was because as much as the book helped people, I know that our Clutter-Free Academy, Clutter-Free for Life and this podcast have helped just exponentially more people. I really, people don’t believe that I was cluttery at one point. And I’m like, no, I’m still cluttery at some points, but.

Tonya Kubo (01:57)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah,

still cluttering. Yeah.

Kathi Lipp (02:09)
I’m not afraid

to invite you into my house. So I wanted to talk about what are some key things that look different now than they did when I was clutter free. number one, I don’t save up decluttering for the weekends. And this has been a huge shift for me because I would always think as I’ve…

Tonya Kubo (02:12)
Mm-hmm.

Mmm.

Kathi Lipp (02:32)
pretty much always been a Monday through Friday, nine to five kind of person and who actually works nine to five. Let’s be clear, it’s eight to six. But I’ve pretty much been that person my whole life and I was just so busy during the week that I’m like, I’m just gonna save all this up for the weekends. And I don’t live like that anymore. Like as I am leaving a room, I’m like, are there things I can grab to throw away, to put away, to declutter?

Tonya Kubo (02:39)
Yeah.

Kathi Lipp (03:00)
Is that similar for you?

Tonya Kubo (03:03)
Yeah, I mean, I still think, you know, because my kids are younger, right? Like our house is always in some state of shambles, but you know, little things that I used to on Fridays clean off my desk, for instance. And now it’s just at the end of the day, right? It just is so much easier to take like a handful of stuff at the end of each day than to have to make multiple trips every Friday.

Kathi Lipp (03:06)
Yes.

Mm-hmm.

Right.

It makes such a difference, right? Because I don’t know, there’s just something about like, I’ve saved this up for an entire week. You know, instead of just saying, okay, a little bit of time, a little bit of time, my brain has shifted into small amounts of decluttering instead of huge mountains of decluttering. Okay, so that’s number one. Tonya, we’re going back and forth. Tonya, what’s number two?

Tonya Kubo (03:33)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Right?

Kathi Lipp (03:54)
something that you don’t do now that you live clutter-free.

Tonya Kubo (03:57)
Okay, so this might seem silly, but I genuinely used to think unloading the dishwasher took 30 minutes and now I realize it takes about three and a half. So I don’t put off unloading the dishwasher till the weekend. Like seriously, I made it into such a big job in my head and I don’t need more.

Kathi Lipp (04:11)
Right?

Yeah, yes,

I feel like doing the dishes could take a half hour if you’ve got a lot of dishes piled up if you have things that need to be soaked like, you know, deep, deep scrub. Right.

Tonya Kubo (04:24)
Right, but I didn’t say doing the dishes, Kathi. I just

said unload the dishwasher.

Kathi Lipp (04:30)
just thinking maybe that’s why your brain was playing tricks on you and here’s what I know is when you when you unload the dishes here’s the magical thing it’s easier to load the dishes I know that seems like it should be obvious but our cluttery people will get that

Tonya Kubo (04:42)
Right.

Yeah, no, exactly, exactly.

Kathi Lipp (04:49)
Yeah, okay. Number three, I don’t stand next to the gas pump while it’s filling up. I, okay, so I think a lot of our cluttering friends will get this. I went, those small moments, like just like you were talking about with the microwave, I unload the dishwasher in the two and a half minutes that my, or I at least get it started in the two and a half minutes that my oatmeal is cooking.

Tonya Kubo (05:01)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (05:18)
And

so now I am married to somebody who does quiet contemplation while his coffee is warming up. And I’m like, you know what, we just live different lives. while I’m pumping my gas, I clean out the car. I just grab a few things. I throw them into the garbage. I feel like that’s free garbage. Garbage is such a big deal up here.

Tonya Kubo (05:24)
Hahaha

Right.

Mm-hmm.

Yes,

it is free garbage. I am right there with you.

Kathi Lipp (05:45)
It makes me so happy. I can’t even stand it. Yeah, I’m never somebody who would bring garbage from my house to throw away. I’ve heard of people doing that. I know. But if I’ve got a McDonald’s cup, that that’s going in the garbage while I’m pumping. It is I’m doing all the things and even like our truck takes a long time to fill up. I have been known to we have a like a hand vac in the truck.

Tonya Kubo (05:53)
Right. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yup.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (06:14)
and I’ve been known to like vacuum things out while I’m doing, yeah, it makes me so happy I can’t even stand it. Okay, but I’m doing, what the core concept behind that is it just takes a moment to make a small difference. And like you just said with the unloading dishwasher and even with the, I don’t save up decluttering for the weekends. If I can do a little bit each day, man, the weekends can be for.

Tonya Kubo (06:17)
Nice.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (06:42)
fun or bigger projects or things like that. Okay, number four, Tonya, what’s something that you don’t do now that you’re living clutter free?

Tonya Kubo (06:44)
Mm-hmm.

I don’t go shopping when I’m tired, hungry, or frustrated.

Kathi Lipp (06:56)
That’s my favorite time to go shopping. Okay, tell me more. Right.

Tonya Kubo (06:58)
It’s everybody’s favorite time to go shopping.

Right. But I mean, something that I learned early on in my clutter free journey is that when I’m tired, I’m hungry or I’m frustrated, my tolerance, like my my impulse control is lower and my desire to soothe is higher. And so I feel like everything I see at the store is going to make me feel better. And it is not.

Kathi Lipp (07:16)
Yeah.

Mmm, good.

Right.

Tonya Kubo (07:26)
to make me feel better. I am still going to leave the store tired, hungry, and frustrated so I may as well just solve those problems before I go.

Kathi Lipp (07:33)
Okay, can I tell you how I’m even worse at this and it’s something I need to correct in my own life. So I go to the store, which is a chore, right? That is an errand. Right. And I feel like because I have done that, even when I was living in San Jose and things were like five minutes, like, look at me checking things off of my list. I deserve a little treat, a little treaty treat. Can we just say that shopping and Target

Tonya Kubo (07:42)
Yeah, it’s a jaunt for you. It’s a jaunt.

Hahaha

Kathi Lipp (08:02)
It’s so much better when you have Starbucks. And so like this is the thinking I have to unpack all the time in my cluttery journey. it just, makes a difference. It makes a difference when you say, and I just, but I try not to go, I pack snacks now in our car so that we are not so tempted.

Tonya Kubo (08:05)
I’m sure it is, I’m sure it is.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (08:32)
Like it’s okay every once in a while to go to Starbucks, but you don’t get Starbucks every time you leave the house. Yes, okay. And so tired, hungry, frustrated will lead you to, and here’s the other part of that that I think is you’re so wise because I’ll just throw things in my cart and I’ll say I’ll return them later if I’m frustrated. Like, you know, don’t go shopping for jeans when you’re tired, frustrated or hungry. That’s just the meanest thing you could do to yourself.

Tonya Kubo (08:32)
Yeah.

Mmm.

No.

Kathi Lipp (09:00)
but then I’ll buy all the jeans and then I’m like, now I have to take them back. And then like, I already have a return right now of a shirt and it’s, we’re recording this around Christmas time. And I’m like, the last thing I want to do on earth is go into a store and return a shirt. Like I can’t think of anything I want to do less. Okay. Number five, I don’t leave a room without scanning the room. So.

Tonya Kubo (09:04)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Hmm

Kathi Lipp (09:27)
What that means is I don’t, I don’t just walk into another room. I will walk into another room, but I will grab the dish that’s on my desk. I will grab the shirt that needs to be returned. Can you tell I’m going through stuff? I will grab the jacket that needs to be hung downstairs. And here’s why I think that this matters. Even if I’m just going into Roger’s office, which is still on the top of the floor.

I’ll move those things to the top of the stairs so that I used to think if I’m gonna do something, I need to do it all the way. And no, I just need to push it forward. I need to push that chore forward. And that makes a huge difference. It’s like, even if I can’t unload the entire dishwasher while my oatmeal is cooking, I’m pushing it forward enough and I’m yelling up to Roger,

Tonya Kubo (10:00)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (10:26)
The dishes are clean, I’m just not done yet. And so he knows not to put dirty dishes in there. But if you can push it forward, then the next time you’re reheating your coffee, you can push it forward another minute and you might get it done. And so scanning a room, seeing what can I push into place? Because here’s what I know, if I leave it all until I have time, then I’m gonna spend half a day going up and down the stairs. And that sounds like my worst nightmare, I hate that stuff.

Tonya Kubo (10:29)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Kathi Lipp (10:56)
Yeah, okay. So we have gone through our top five. We’re gonna take a quick break, pay some bills. We’re gonna come back and Tonya is gonna talk about how she doesn’t apologize. I can’t wait to hear about how you do this. Teach me, Obi-Wan. We’ll be right back. Okay, guys, we are back with 10 things I don’t do now that I live clutter free. So Tonya, you say you don’t apologize. For what?

Tonya Kubo (11:23)
I

apologize for the condition of my house.

Kathi Lipp (11:26)
So tell me more. Tell me how I can get brave and be really like, just come on in.

Tonya Kubo (11:33)
well, just stop doing it. I mean, that’s how I did it, right? It was like a cold turkey. Like, I think there was a bit of a transition of where I would say, I probably should apologize for the state of my house, but I won’t. But I just don’t. And, you know, some people come in and say stuff and some people don’t, and I don’t really care. Because what I realize is we all have a different standard. You know, I used to apologize. And I realized that a lot of people

Kathi Lipp (11:37)
wow.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Tonya Kubo (12:03)
Like, first of all, I would apologize after spending hours doing a crisis clean because I knew other people would come in and like, and feel like my house was in complete disarray. And I was like, why am I acting like I didn’t just kill myself to make this house look nicer? And then I got to where, you know what? What do I care? mean, people come in, sometimes people are like, wow, you must be really busy. I am. That’s not untrue. I am really busy.

Kathi Lipp (12:13)
Mmm.

Right, right.

It’s a great friend test, right? Can we hang? Can we hang? Yeah.

Tonya Kubo (12:33)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, but I’m just

like, there’s nothing they could say that’s probably not true to some degree. And I’ve had like repair guys come in, it’s funny, is because the repair guys will come in and our front room doesn’t have flooring. We tore up the flooring and then building costs went up so we have not replaced the flooring. And they’ll go to put the booties on them like, yeah, that’s cute. You don’t have to do that here. And they’ll look around and they’re like, okay.

Kathi Lipp (12:49)
All right. Yeah.

Tonya Kubo (13:01)
Every now and then they’ll say, are you sure? Like, yeah, no, we’re good here.

Kathi Lipp (13:06)
Yeah.

Well, it’s so true. Our lives are all in transition, right? And when you have kids, the amount of day-to-day clutter goes up exponentially. Or maybe you’re in the midst of a big project. You know, I’ll never forget during the launch of Clutter Free, book, the state my house was in. It was like, we can’t take any pictures. And just recently,

Tonya Kubo (13:12)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (13:35)
Tenneil who manages our social media said, Kathi, can we get a video of you pushing in a chair? And right now we’re in Christmas crazies. I’m like, it would take me 45 minutes to get to a place to push in a chair. Right, it’s, yeah, because there’s all the fudge making supplies right there, yeah. So are you really, are you using marshmallow fluff in it?

Tonya Kubo (13:45)
No. To push in the chair. You’re like, “‘Cause I can’t get to the chair to push it in.”

Yes, I’m making fudge this weekend too. Anyway, I am.

I am using marshmallow fluff in it. I took a whole class on how to make fudge using marshmallow fluff. It was fun.

Kathi Lipp (14:05)
I saw that I saw that well,

I saw the fudge class. I didn’t know that there was the marshmallow fluff. Yeah, I’m very excited I’m just using a recipe off the internet But as you know, we live next to not next to you know half I don’t know 20 minutes away from a gourmet chocolate shop, which is the only Yeah, they’re a whiner They ship they’re so good but also let’s just say their fudge has gourmet prices and I’m like

Tonya Kubo (14:16)
Mm-hmm.

Little John’s, they ship. Little John’s, you should order from Little John’s.

Yes

Kathi Lipp (14:35)
How much would it cost for me to do this? And Roger’s like, we can buy their other stuff. We never have to buy fudge again. And I was like, I’m an indentured fudge servant now. Got it. Okay. Okay. You know what? It’s good. Hey, speaking of fudge, number seven, I don’t buy all the gear for hobbies unless I have a pattern of doing the hobby. Because here’s what I’ve discovered, Tonya. You know what my hobby is? Buying the stuff for hobbies.

Tonya Kubo (14:44)
Yes, I am too.

Mmm.

I

was gonna say preparing to have a hobby.

Kathi Lipp (15:07)
So here’s what I said, know, like one of the recipes that I am preparing right now called for a candy thermometer. And I’m like, ugh.

Tonya Kubo (15:17)
I need that for the fudge recipe with the marshmallow fluff. You need a candy thermometer.

Kathi Lipp (15:20)
Okay, so here’s what I told

myself if I prepare three recipes right now that don’t require the the thermometer if I if I prepare these three Christmas gift II things then I am allowed to buy a Candy thermometer and I got one by the way Michaels has 30 % off coupons for a while now. So go check that out I got the I think it’s the Wilson one but

Tonya Kubo (15:34)
Mm-hmm.

Ew.

Kathi Lipp (15:49)
I cannot tell you how many hobbies I’ve invested in and had to keep that stuff because I invest I told myself I’ve invested so heavily I need to keep all this stuff. It just it doesn’t make sense and it’s not the right thing. So I no longer I need to have a pattern of Can I start this hobby with stuff I have or can I start this hobby for less than ten dollars? And if I find that I really enjoy it

Tonya Kubo (15:54)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (16:19)
Then I will keep going but I am NOT going to go I’ll just say my history is buying at a professional level and performing at an amateur level like it’s not good

Tonya Kubo (16:30)
I

know that feeling though. If I have the same paints and brushes that Bob Ross has, I will make the same pictures that Bob Ross made.

Kathi Lipp (16:37)
Right.

Right, right.

And you know, our friend Cheri Gregory, friend of the podcast, Cheri Gregory calls it buying to become and I have done that for years and years. Okay, Tonya, number eight.

Tonya Kubo (16:49)
Yeah.

Okay, I kind of stole from you because you said that you scan a room before you leave. Before I go to bed, I make a round through the house specifically for dirty dishes. And here’s my, if I made a round through my house for decluttering, I would never make it to bed. But I can make a pass through my teeny tiny house just for dirty dishes in about 25 minutes. And it makes my life so much easier that

Kathi Lipp (16:58)
Yeah. Yeah.

so smart.

No, of course not.

Hmm

Tonya Kubo (17:24)
Like, know, because all run into bulls, where are all the bulls? The bulls are in the kids’ room underneath the bed. Why are they underneath the bed? I actually can’t answer that question, but that is where I find them.

Kathi Lipp (17:33)
Okay, Tonya, we are missing a bowl right now. There are just two of us. There are just two of us. This giant glass bowl, we cannot find. Is it under Lily’s bed? That’s my question now.

Tonya Kubo (17:36)
Maybe it’s under my bed!

It’s probably under Lily’s bed, and this is the worst of it, right? Is the way that Abby’s bed works, it sits lower to the ground. So Abby shoves stuff underneath Lily’s bed too. It’s not even all Lily’s fault.

Kathi Lipp (17:52)
Ugh.

Poor Lily. I’m sorry Lily. I did not mean to throw you under the bus bus or the bed Okay, so you do so what 25 minutes that seems like a long time so break that down for me Really okay

Tonya Kubo (18:13)
It’s a lot of dishes in my kid’s room and a lot of

dishes by Mr. Kubo’s desk. So it’s two trips. Two to three trips from the girl’s room, two trips from Brian’s desk and then

Kathi Lipp (18:20)
Got it. So you’re having to make multiple trips. Got it. Okay. And then

And and you’re

loading you’re soaking all that. Okay, that makes more sense. Okay Okay, that makes total sense. And I think doing doing a round of dishes I really feel like when everything else in your life falls apart the two things that you need to stay on top of are dishes and laundry because Mm-hmm. Yeah

Tonya Kubo (18:49)
Yes and I will say just really quickly that 25 minutes

does include a good five minute temper tantrum of my gosh what is growing in this thing.

Kathi Lipp (19:00)
I love it. Yeah, the the the Dishes and laundry if you stay on top of those like I don’t care how crunchy your kitchen floor gets I don’t care, you know at the I would say the third thing but this doesn’t have to be done as Much is staying on top of bills. Those are the important things that if you fall behind on them It’s going to be super painful to recover from them

Tonya Kubo (19:01)
That’s in there too.

No.

Mm-hmm. yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (19:25)
But if you can stay on top of those three things, it takes almost the same amount of energy to mop the floor when it’s been a week or five weeks. Like, I don’t want you to have to go five weeks, but if you need to in a crisis, you can. And yeah, and also stay on top of your garbage and recycling. number nine. This is my last thing of things I don’t do now that I live clutter free.

Tonya Kubo (19:37)
Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (19:55)
Okay, I try not to I’m still working through this but I’m much better than I used to be I don’t compare my stuff to my friends stuff so Or stuff on social media. There is always a new thing That would make my life two percent easier or two percent better Not not my entire life if something made my entire life two percent better you bet I’m going to invest in that but like

Tonya Kubo (20:04)
Mmm.

Kathi Lipp (20:25)
Let’s say, know, my, my robot vacuum, there are now robot vacuums that you can control remotely. Like I could be at my mom’s house and now I could get that doesn’t make my life better enough to upgrade my robot. Like my robots fine. We get along. We, she does what she needs to do. I’m sorry. It’s normally a he. I don’t know why I said she, cause I like for all my domestic labor to be he’s.

Tonya Kubo (20:34)
Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (20:55)
Because I just think that’s fair But I Just because somebody else has something that has made their life Infamates Lee better. It doesn’t mean that I need to upgrade it. I I try when I see you wearing a cute sweater I’m not going to say you know what? need that cute sweater. I’m gonna I’m one of things I’m trying to do is go into my own closet

Tonya Kubo (21:09)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (21:22)
and see

my own cute sweaters and the things that make me happy. So I’m trying really hard to reframe what my friends have. And also that can be a form of jealousy. I can just say, you know what? I’m really happy that Tonya has that sweater. I think she looks great in it. She’s having fun with it. And it makes me happy to see her in it. And it doesn’t have to be, I don’t have to own it for it to bring me happiness. So trying to stay out of that comparison trap.

Tonya Kubo (21:33)
Mmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Kathi Lipp (21:52)
And I’m sure when you go into people’s houses that have floors, that can be hard.

Tonya Kubo (21:57)
I do have floor envy right now, I’m not gonna lie. If you’ve got luxury vinyl plank, I’m eyeballing your floors, let me tell ya.

Kathi Lipp (21:59)
I you do.

And I do have that upstairs and I wrestled over that decision for about two years And I’m so glad we pulled the trigger It’s so painful to get flooring done just because of all the moving and shifting and all that kind of stuff Okay, Tonya round out our list. Give us number ten. All right

Tonya Kubo (22:09)
Yeah, no.

It is.

My cluttery peeps will get this. I no longer gain comfort or security from having full shelves, full drawers, etc.

Kathi Lipp (22:33)
yeah, space scares us, doesn’t it? Yeah.

Tonya Kubo (22:37)
Space is scary because space is scarcity and lack and my gosh what

if I don’t have enough. But if things are full even if they’re full of stuff that you haven’t worn in 22 years you believe you have enough clothes if for some reason they stopped making all clothing.

Kathi Lipp (22:48)
Right?

Mm-hmm.

Okay, so Tonya, this is so interesting. A number of people on TikTok and other apps are doing a no buy 2025, right? And the conventional wisdom is declutter your closet so you can see what you have. And then, so you know what you have, because it is, it’s easier to see what you have when you have less stuff in your closet.

Tonya Kubo (23:04)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Kathi Lipp (23:22)
But I heard one woman, I thought this was so interesting. And I’m just gonna throw this out there for your reaction. She goes, I am not decluttering before my 2025. Because when I declutter, I feel like there is empty space. And I feel this urge to fill that space with shopping, with thrifting, with all these other things. So what she is doing is she is.

Tonya Kubo (23:39)
Mm-hmm.

Kathi Lipp (23:50)
putting some of her clothes into another closet, including clothes she likes, so that she will, she remember, I’ve got more stuff. I don’t know, how does that hit you? I thought it was really interesting. Really.

Tonya Kubo (23:53)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

I have a friend who does that actually. she has,

yeah, so she boxes up all of her extra stuff, even if it’s in the current season. And she has it all in like the rafters of her garage. But whenever she’s like, I wanna go shopping, she just goes and she takes a box down and she trades out pieces.

Kathi Lipp (24:10)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

You know, I think it’s really interesting. And so I’m not saying one way is better than the other. I’m going to try the other closet boxing because yeah, when I pull out all my winter stuff, I’m so happy. I’m like, I never need to go shopping again. And then after about two weeks, I’m like, you know, people are really into these green grandpa sweaters and like, okay, Kathi, stop, stop, stop, stop.

Tonya Kubo (24:50)
Yeah,

see, and I’m the person, I want all of my clothing to be able to fit in this much of my closet. Like, I don’t wanna ever change anything out. I don’t wanna work that hard. I’m just so, like, I don’t wanna say lazy, but really it’s just like, that is just something that takes such a high level of perceived energy for me that I’m like, I’m good.

Kathi Lipp (24:56)
Yes, you.

Yeah.

Okay, see, even within our Cluttery community, we all have our own little quirks. And that’s why it’s okay for you to forge your own path, but think about the wisdom that will get you to the next space in your Clutter-free journey. I hope one of these has inspired you today. Tonya, thanks so much for hanging out with me.

Tonya Kubo (25:18)
We do.

Thanks for having me.

Kathi Lipp (25:37)
And friends, thank you for being here. You’ve been listening to Clutter-Free Academy. I’m Kathi Lipp. Now, go create the clutter-free life you always wanted to live.

#667 – Clutter Free Finances: Taking Control of Subscriptions

On this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo dive deep into the world of subscription services and the hidden costs they can incur over time. As many of us fall into the habit of acquiring more subscriptions than we need, our finances begin to...

#666 – The Nightstand Reset: Creating a Launch Pad for Peace

In this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo delve into the importance of a tidy nightstand for a better night's sleep and a more organized life. They discuss Kathi's recent purchase of new nightstands with built-in outlets, her nighttime routine...

#665 – Declutter Your Spice Cabinet: From Chaos to Cooking Bliss

In this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo tackle one of the most deceptively frustrating spots in your kitchen: the spice cabinet. If you’ve ever bought a second (or sixth) bottle of basil because you couldn’t find the first one, or had cumin...

ORDER THE CLUTTER-FREE HOME

#536 How to Get Rid of 250 Items in One Day

by Clutter Free Academy Team | Oct 25, 2022 | Clutter Free, Clutter Free Home, Clutter Free Podcast, Getting Started, Home, Podcast | 0 comments

Listen Now

536: How to get Rid of 250 Things in One Day

Are you up for the challenge of decluttering 250 things in one day? Kathi and Tonya Kubo, the original decluttering queen and the fearless leader of Clutter Free, are laying the foundation for decluttering those 250 items in one day by answering some of the hows and whys of this project. So, whether you’re thinking: 250 things in one day is not doable, you’re plotting a way you could do this challenge every day for a month until your house is just the way you want it, or somewhere in between, this conversation is for you. Kathi and Tonya will give you guidelines and creative ideas for accomplishing it by:

Knowing when a great time for a 250-item declutter day is
Knowing how and why to plan for where the clutter will go
Getting a jump start on the November challenge

If you’re interested in tackling the 30 Day 1k Challenge, be sure to join us in the Clutter Free Academy Facebook Group.

10252022_-_KL_Insta_Story_(Instagram_Post_quote)

THE CLUTTER FREE HOME

When it comes to your home, peace is possible…

Longing for a place of peace from which you can love others well? The Clutter-Free Home is your room-by-room guide to decluttering, reclaiming, and celebrating every space of your home.

Let author Kathi Lipp (who once lived a life buried in clutter) walk you through each room of your house to create organizational zones that are not only functional and practical but create places of peace that reflect your personality. Kathi will help you tackle the four-step process of dedicate, decide, declutter and “do-your-thing” to reveal the home you’ve always dreamed of and then transform it into a haven that reflects who you truly are meant to be.

Links Mentioned:

The Clutter-Free Home

Learn more about Clutter Free for Life.

Clutter Free Academy Facebook Group

Tonya Kubo

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Meet Our Guest

Tonya Kubo

Tonya Kubo is the illustrious and fearless leader of Kathi Lipp’s Clutter Free Academy Facebook group and the Clutter Free for Life membership program. A speaker and writer, Tonya makes her home in the heart of California with her husband, Brian, their two spirited daughters, and one very tolerant cat. Visit her at www.tonyakubo.com.

Transcript

#667 – Clutter Free Finances: Taking Control of Subscriptions

On this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo dive deep into the world of subscription services and the hidden costs they can incur over time. As many of us fall into the habit of acquiring more subscriptions than we need, our finances begin to...

#666 – The Nightstand Reset: Creating a Launch Pad for Peace

In this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo delve into the importance of a tidy nightstand for a better night's sleep and a more organized life. They discuss Kathi's recent purchase of new nightstands with built-in outlets, her nighttime routine...

#665 – Declutter Your Spice Cabinet: From Chaos to Cooking Bliss

In this episode of Clutter Free Academy, Kathi Lipp and Tonya Kubo tackle one of the most deceptively frustrating spots in your kitchen: the spice cabinet. If you’ve ever bought a second (or sixth) bottle of basil because you couldn’t find the first one, or had cumin...