
Do you have a loved one that struggles with hoarding? On today’s episode Tonya Kubo joins Kathi as they discuss what it’s like to live with and love a family member who struggles with hoarding.
In this episode you will learn:
- the difference between hoarding and clutter
- why hoarding is really a symptom of anxiety
- how to practice empathy with loved ones while understanding that only hoarders can help themselves
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Special thanks to Tonya for joining me again this week!
Meet Our Guest

Tonya Kubo
Tonya Kubo is the illustrious, fearless leader of Kathi Lipp’s Clutter-Free Academy Facebook group.A speaker and writer, Tonya makes her home in the heart of California with her husband, Brian, their two spirited daughters and one very tolerant cat. Visit her at www.GreatMoms.org.
Thank you for sharing your stories. What an important issue to consider and to be able to empathize with folks who hoard their things and see the deeper issues at stake.
My 65 year old aunt is a paranoid schizophrenic, at times manic and is also a major hoarder. She would fill her car to the ceiling with only room to drive. Not to mention her home… it was on the verge of being sited by the health department before my dad got in there to clean it out and get her into an adult care situation.
Her illness is rooted in an abusive marriage in her early 20s. He left her and took all their money and she was never the same. Never married again, no kids, and she is now dependent on my parents (her brother) after being asked to leave the adult care facility for running up utilities and creating a huge mess.
She will not stay on her meds and triples their water and electric bill every month. Her hoarding has taken over again and my parents don’t know where to set boundaries for her other than requiring rent and food / utility costs. My mom has to clean out her space when she’s not there.
It’s difficult to see them burdened by her illness, but she is family, no one else can care for her, and there is no sign of her improving. It’s a sad situation for sure and absolutely an axiety disorder that no one knows how to help.
I realize this may be an extreme case coupled with another mental illness, but what should families do when there seems like no other option to control the chaos they create for themselves?
Jenn – What a challenging situation all around. Your aunt’s distress is distressing to your parents, which is then distressing to you as their daughter. We unpack this topic all week. Episode 329 is now live with some suggestions and there is a blog article going up on Thursday that further offers resources to those who love hoarders. Beyond all that, your parents might need to seek help themselves. A counselor who understands hoarding, anxiety and schizophrenia may help them understand how to set boundaries with your aunt in their home or at least give them insight into recognizing when the situation is bigger than what they can shoulder. Please keep us updated as you’re able so we can continue to pray. Thank you again for sharing with us and our readers.
Correction: Part 2 of the podcast is Episode 328B
I just wanted to thank you and Tonya Kubo. Yesterday I listened to part 1 and 2. Two things stood out to be so strong that gave me grace for me and mercy for my husband. We have been married 23 years. It took me 10 plus years to realize he had more than clutter issues. I often feel judged by others… how can you let him get away with that, you need to put your foot down… so on and so on. Today, what is speaking so loudly to my heart…. 1) Don’t argue (or even get irritated) over the stuff – instead set the boundaries on space. Which I am really proud of myself. My son just moved out – joining the Air Force…. and I have stool my ground that that space is mine. no stuff! 2) Not expecting him to be able to just get rid of stuff. Giving him the grace and God the time He needs to work on him. (without me being irritated and judging etc.) I would love to hear more or read more on those who are married to people who hoard. It is different than having a parent etc….
Thank you so much for today’s podcast. I felt that I could relate so much with Tonya’s experience with her mom. I knew our house was always clutterred when I was growing
up but I think that it became a comfort to my mom when my dad died and things just kept piling up and getting worse. I have offered to help but it always goes back the way it was. I would love it if you would continue to explore this subject for a while. I think it is the fear and shame of becoming a hoarder myself that keeps me a regular listener. I am almost the opposite of a hoarder because I get so scared when just a few things pile up. I would like to know more about stepping in to help an aging parent and how this relates to hoarding. I feel like my moms clutter tendency deepened into hoarding after my dads death. As a part of this behavior my mom is unable to keep up with her cats and unwilling to ask for help. I tried to step in and help because I felt that she was allowing unhealthy conditions but the situation is always the same when I come back (as Tonya described.) I don’t live nearby so I can only go every two weeks, which wasn’t nearly enough to keep up with the cats. My mom recently said that she feels guilty when she is around me. So, I have stopped going to clean up after the cats. I feel like I am stuck because she doesn’t want me helping but I don’t feel like it is a safe or healthy place. I struggle with this too because part of me wants it cleaned up because I am embarrassed and I am not sure that my motives are 100% pure. I have offered to have someone come in each week to help with the cats but she doesn’t want anyone to come into the house. As a side note I worry that all of the stuff could catch fire. I don’t know if she could get out without falling or tripping over something. I am not the only one who sees this but I am the only one who seems to think there is a problem, which makes me feel crazy. Other people say that it is not that bad. They say to me things like “not everybody has a perfect house!” (My house is not perfect-we have a 3yr old and I work full time.). I was wondering if you or Tonya have any suggestions on when to step in? How do you recognize when it’s time from a health and safety perspective. Or is what I describe seem like an over reaction to you too? Thank you for your podcast.
Laura – It means so much to have you share your story. It is so similar to mine and I don’t think it’s an over-reaction. Hoarders tell stories and people want to believe the stories because it’s easier than facing the reality of a situation like you describe. We offer suggestions in Part 2 of the podcast, which is now live (Episode 329). We’ll also have a blog article on Thursday that lays out five steps you can take and include additional resources. Animal hoarding is in a category of its own and truly does have health and safety impacts. I think it’s both wise and loving of you to be concerned about the cat situation. There may come a time when you need to call adult services to intervene to protect your mom from herself, which will be difficult. I hope this week’s exploration of hoarding helps you, and I also hope you’ll keep us updated on how your specific situation evolves. Thank you.
Correction: Part 2 of the podcast is Episode 328B
I heard myself a little in what you both were saying. Although I try to keep it to a minimum and contained, I feel anxiety when I start going through things to throw them away. I know they need to be thrown away but can’t explain why I can’t throw stuff away. When my husband starts to go through things and throws them away I get upset and tell him to stop. I want to be the one to go through it and sort it. I don’t want to get like those I see on that show so what do I do now to make sure I don’t progress to that? Any constructive input you can give would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!
Amy – Thank you so much for sharing your story with us. We offer suggestions in Part 2 of the podcast, which is now available (Episode 329). Seeking the help of a professional who specializes in anxiety and compulsive behaviors might be valuable for you because he/she could help you better understand why you feel the way you do and partner with you on a plan to throw things away. I think it’s amazing that you recognize that you want change but struggle with it. So many people in a similar situations would not be as self-aware. Please keep us updated so we know how to pray and so we might also encourage you moving forward.
Thank you so much for this! The problem is not over with the death of the hoarder! My late husband died over three years ago and I am still struggling with going through his mess! Last week I gave a friend two sets of windshield wipers thinking they were new but just dusty, but we found that they were USED. What he had done was replace the wipers, put the old ones into the new box, close it up and SAVE them! They must be at least 20 years old. My backyard storage building has things falling out of the door when it is opened. There are at least three nonworking weed eaters out there, but I do not own a working one. I am 84 and have to hire men to move the heavy containers, but I get exhausted trying to sort, throw away, recycle the junk. During our marriage I finally just had to not discuss the problem because he would get so angry. Fortunately only the office and his bedroom drawers in our home were filled with junk, but now I can’t throw away any piles of paper because I found our mortgage papers in a box filled with junk paper, so each piece of paper must be picked up and read because discarding. Please pray for me! I am asking the Lord for strength and strong workers to help me glorify Him in this property. Also have his parents’ house in the country complete with barn and other structures filled with junk. I believe that nothing is impossible with God. Some days I can see a little progress; other days it is so depressing to sort junk! Thank you!
Redeemed One – Your situation is particularly challenging and I so appreciate you sharing it with us because I believe you are not alone. Having treasures (like your mortgage papers) hidden in the trash is especially difficult, because it does create a need to go through everything carefully and that can overwhelm the best of us. I would encourage you to be gentle with yourself – your place didn’t get like this overnight and you won’t be able to clear through things overnight. It sounds to me like you’re making a lot of positive progress. You’re on the right track with hiring or recruiting help. We’ll be praying for your situation, and I hope you keep us updated so we can cheer you on as you continue on this journey.
Correction: Part 2 of the podcast is Episode 328B
Usually the title company or bank can access copies of those papers. Maybe a slight fee